ES Fsport - first 1000 Miles

[fetchez la vache]

 

Just a quick warts and all assessment of the first 1000 miles in my ES.  All typed into my phone so please excuse lack of proof reading! The car is an Fsport with Takumi pack.

THE GOOD

Quietness - a very quiet and insulated cabin.  once you are at cruising speed, its impressively quiet.

Engine -  the new 300H unit is much improved over the old one in my IS.  It is now capable of cutting to electric power at high speed (circa 80mph) and in Eco mode this will combine with the active glide control so that you are gliding along without the regenerative system slowing you down.  Although the power rating is similar to the old unit, it does feel abit quicker.

Efficiency - also improved, 50mpg is easy to achieve on a journey, that’s impressive for a big car.

Handling - I’m really pleased I went for the Fsport with the adaptive suspension set-up. Although it’s not the most advaced set-up, it strikes a very good balance.  In eco/ normal mode it has a nice comfortable ride, with a nice degree of ‘wallow’, the 19inch wheels detract from this a little but it’s still good.  Sport and Sports+ just tightens it up enough to give it a sporty edge.  You would never take it on a trackday, but it feels a nicely resolved set-up. Front wheel drive is really not an issue in handling terms.

Audio - the ML setup is fantastic, I’m a self confessed hifi geek and feeding Lossless Tidal hifi into the ML system sounds incredible.  I’m going to play about with master quality files to really stretch its legs.  The quietness of the cabin also helps the audio playback.

Quality -  everything feels really well screwed together, if feels a high quality product.

Size - it’s a big car at nearly 5metres Long and the interior space is huge.  You can stretch the front seats right back and there will still be ample room in the back.  But it doesn’t feel like a large car to drive,  I think this is a combination of a relatively low curb weight (1750kg?) and good front visibility. 

Exclusivity -  it’s a little thing, but the number of ES’s sold will be tiny in the UK.  You feel like Toyota have spent billions of dollars developing a car just for you.  I think the chances of seeing another car on the road this year are very small. It’s nice to drive something a little different.

Details - lots of nice little touches.  keyless entry working on the back door  handles as well as front.  it’s a small thing but when you are parked in a car park it means you don’t have to squeeze your way to the front handle.  Front radar is hidden behind the Lexus logo,so no unslightly black plastic square in the grille.  If you have the sun blind up and reverse the car, it automatically lowers.  It has a G meter! The Takumi pack includes a credit car key, pop it in you wallet and you don’t need your keys.  Heads up display is massive and contains all sort of information such as audio track name, it will also just flash up with a massive red ‘BRAKE’ sign if it thinks you are going to hit the car in front....the front internal lights are touch sensitive.  the auto function for the heated wheel and seats works really well. Adaptive LED headlights are fantastic, they also include cornering lights. When you turn them on they go through some sort of lighting sequence, Again abit bling but nice. The front indicators are sequential LED, again abit bling (but nice). If you get too close to the car in front in slowing traffic, you can temporarily mute the parking sensor with the ok button on the steering wheel.

THE BAD

Seats -  although very supportive and look good, they are synthetic in the FSport.  They really should be leather. The leather trim on the dash, wheel and gear selector is good quality but it’s a big omission for the rest of the cabin to be synthetic but I did know about this beforehand.  No vented option on seats, this was great in my IS. 

Front wheel drive -  it’s a very good set up but with the UK roads, when you hit a bad pothole it will loose traction and the TC will light . A really bad surface will leave the front trying to find grip and you will get a sideways movement on the front end.  It’s a typical FWD trait, RWD is a more composed setup for poor road surfaces. 

Cabin - there are a few cheaper plastics on the bottom of the door trims, it’s a typical Toyota setup which is fine.  However, the areas around the base of the centre console should be better quality materials.

Exterior chrome.  The chrome detailing to the front and back is smoked on the FSport.  The sides of the car has unsmoked chrome.  It’s a little thing, but that is just odd!! 

Rear privacy glass.  It’s too dark, it’s basically black.

Boot -  Width and depth is good but the sloping rear profile robs it of height, it’s adequate size but not brilliant.

infotainment -  the 12inch screen is great, no problem using the trackpad, it actually works very well.  The system feels under-utilised.  There is an App Store but no apps? No CarPlay, only miracast? No idea what this is but not supported by apple. 80% of it is good, it just feels like the last 20% is unfinished. 

cooling fan -  the Battery pack under the back seats has a cooling port at low level on the drivers side.  I’m not sure if it’s on at all times but I parked up the other day and you can actually hear the fan working behind you.

My impression of the first 1000 miles.  In general, I’m a very happy customer.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mike246]

James,

Well that's certainly a detailed report - astounding if you tapped it into your Iphone!

Other readers no doubt will pick-up on your assertion that the F-Sport seat coverings are synthetic. This seems so unlikely for a £40k Lexus and is at variance with the spec in the online brochure.

If this is the case, I have concerns about the vehicle I have on order. Can you re-visit this?

 

[fetchez la vache]

Hi Mike,

thanks for the reply.  I’m not sure what to say really, they call it Black Tahara trim. Looks and feels like leather but it’s a synthetic alternative, I think this is the same spec as the base model without the premium pack...

 

[Mike246]

Hmm, I'm more than a little concerned as clearly you know what you are about when it comes to the ES.

The online brochure quotes the F-Sport seats as leather on some pages and Tahara (no mention of leather) in others. I've found one or two other matters of detail which are also at variance. 

I'm going to have a chat with Lexus Customer Services tomorrow and I have a loan ES booked for Tuesday. I'll report back.

[fetchez la vache]

Apologies Mike, I don’t want to spoil your purchase, I suppose only you know if your happy with this.  I did raise this with my Lexus dealer during the test drive, the salesman was unsure so he checked for me and confirmed they are synthetic.  If it makes a difference, a base model AMG line E class is the same.. 

[SH20]

Tahara trim is synthetic.  Actually looks like ultra smooth leather but isn't.    I ordered an ES300h with a premium pack so as to avoid the Tahara trim.

[i-s]

This is becoming commonplace. It's similar for Audi, BMW and Merc cars at similar pricepoints. I've just ordered a Tesla at similar price to the ES300h, and it too is synthetic "vegan" leather (except that Tesla admit that the steering wheel is real leather - apparently the synthetic isn't hard-wearing enough for that). 

[First_Lexus]

I had Tahara on my first NX Sport and now have real leather on my current NX Luxury. Apart from the smell in hot weather - plasticky with the Tahara - you'd be hard pressed to spot a difference, except the Tahara was softer to the touch.

Mercedes have been using 'Artico' for years - 'artificial cow' - as do many other makers. 

Personally I'd prefer a suede option to either...but that's probably just me being contrary. I've never been a big fan of leather in cars.

ES looks like a nice vehicle. Great write-up @fetchez la vache

[Mike246]

James (fetchez la vache) dropped a bombshell in his write-up by stating that the upholstery is synthetic. He was gracious enough to follow this with an apology in case he has spoiled my intended purchase.

I have not been idle since learning of this. I have had an ES F-sport Takumi Pack on order since February for July delivery. The options have been carefully considered and where necessary discussed further with the supplying dealership. The upholstery has not been discussed as I was in no doubt from Lexus' on-line brochure (there isn't a printed one) that leather is standard on the F-Sport - Pages 40 & 53 confirm this.

I took this up with Lexus Customer Service. They referred this and came back within a couple of days to confirm that the seats are synthetic and therefore the on-line brochure is wrong. I discussed with them the option of changing tor a base model with Premium Pack (as SH20) and Rich Cream leather - they told me that I would have to have a brown fascia whereas I would wish for black; in doing this I would have to forego the Takumi Pack as ordered which includes the larger satnav screen.

As a general point, many people would prefer leather on a premium car, some might prefer synthetic, others may not be bothered and there may be ethical views. Staining on light leather could be a nightmare. Certainly on a car of this stature and price I would expect no less than quality leather. I raised this issue on the US owners' forum and was told that their ES comes with synthetic seats however an upgrade to perforated leather is available.

First-Lexus makes an interesting point that he would prefer suede. My 1998 GS300 SE has leather which has stood the test of time in the 20 years I have owned it. The non-SE version came with Alcantara - a super Italian suede-like material which was tactile, hard-wearing and as expensive per-metre as leather.

In any event if the car was delivered with plastic seats contrary to Lexus published spec I would hand it back so I am indebted to James for his observations.

So what am I to do? I've considered this carefully and decided that I am going to cancel my order this coming week and buy a Mazda. It's not a hybrid but it comes with quality leather upholstery, all of the goodies including apple CarPlay and a powered trunk. It will be delivered in 2 weeks and costs £10k less than the ES.

I have three Lexus models in the driveway and this will be the first non-Lexus I will have bought in the last 15 years. This is the first negative post I have ever made regarding Lexus.

[ColinBarber]

What is disappointing is the brochure you have, that was released before the final spec of the ES in the UK was known, is still the current one, even though there are errors in it. Whilst there is a big disclaimer at the end stating that there may be errors and that the spec listed doesn't constitute a sales offer, it really should be withdrawn until a replacement has been published.

We are seeing a lot more manufacturers going with synthetic leather, not just for cost savings but for ethical reasons where owners want an alternative and Telsa have gone to the extreme of not offering any real leather options in their vehicles. But what is odd is that the new Toyota Camry comes with leather as standard on both trim grades, on a vehicle that costs quite a bit less than the ES. 

[First_Lexus]

@Mike246

Assume you are going for the Mazda 6? If so, im amazed it is £10k less than the ES with comparable spec - feels like an obviously decision to me, leather or no leather!

The only thing that might put me off is that powered trunk. I think it will look odd unless you have the big grey ears to go with it...

[Mike246]

27 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

@Mike246

The only thing that might put me off is that powered trunk. I think it will look odd unless you have the big grey ears to go with it...

As a matter of fact I do . . . . and a long memory!

[i-s]

Are you sure that the Mazda is real leather - I'm not saying it's not (and I've always quite liked the 6), I'm just saying be 100% - it is absolutely remarkable to me what they are allowed to describe as "Leather" these days. A synthetic product that contains some tiny %age of animal skin sourced fibres is allowed to be described as "genuine leather". My mum's Toyota Landcruiser (120 series Invincible) and my Nissan Leaf both have something that vaugely approximates leather and is described as "leather" but leaves me unconvinced. 

Given the current leather backlash then I agree that a greater variety of high-quality, high-end non-leather options should be made available. In Japan, wool cloth seats seem to be regarded as the utmost luxury, and our Queen's state limousine is upholstered in Lambswool sateen cloth. It would seem that that would be an option that could be made available? 

Another that I'd love to see would be Linen - very hard-wearing and a lovely material. Breathable and warm. Plus, very high on the sustainability scale!

I'll see how I get on with the plastic seats in the Tesla. I'm not planning on changing that car for a long time (nor our GS - after a mad flurry of buying cars over the past 18 months that should be us done for 10 years!), so if they really bother me then I might spend a chunk on having the seats re-upholstered. There's a place in Manchester that does good work. 

[fetchez la vache]

On 5/11/2019 at 8:30 PM, Mike246 said:

James (fetchez la vache) dropped a bombshell in his write-up by stating that the upholstery is synthetic. He was gracious enough to follow this with an apology in case he has spoiled my intended purchase.

I have not been idle since learning of this. I have had an ES F-sport Takumi Pack on order since February for July delivery. The options have been carefully considered and where necessary discussed further with the supplying dealership. The upholstery has not been discussed as I was in no doubt from Lexus' on-line brochure (there isn't a printed one) that leather is standard on the F-Sport - Pages 40 & 53 confirm this.

I took this up with Lexus Customer Service. They referred this and came back within a couple of days to confirm that the seats are synthetic and therefore the on-line brochure is wrong. I discussed with them the option of changing tor a base model with Premium Pack (as SH20) and Rich Cream leather - they told me that I would have to have a brown fascia whereas I would wish for black; in doing this I would have to forego the Takumi Pack as ordered which includes the larger satnav screen.

As a general point, many people would prefer leather on a premium car, some might prefer synthetic, others may not be bothered and there may be ethical views. Staining on light leather could be a nightmare. Certainly on a car of this stature and price I would expect no less than quality leather. I raised this issue on the US owners' forum and was told that their ES comes with synthetic seats however an upgrade to perforated leather is available.

First-Lexus makes an interesting point that he would prefer suede. My 1998 GS300 SE has leather which has stood the test of time in the 20 years I have owned it. The non-SE version came with Alcantara - a super Italian suede-like material which was tactile, hard-wearing and as expensive per-metre as leather.

In any event if the car was delivered with plastic seats contrary to Lexus published spec I would hand it back so I am indebted to James for his observations.

So what am I to do? I've considered this carefully and decided that I am going to cancel my order this coming week and buy a Mazda. It's not a hybrid but it comes with quality leather upholstery, all of the goodies including Apple CarPlay and a powered trunk. It will be delivered in 2 weeks and costs £10k less than the ES.

I have three Lexus models in the driveway and this will be the first non-Lexus I will have bought in the last 15 years. This is the first negative post I have ever made regarding Lexus.

Hello Mike, I’m really pleased that you were able to make an informed decision, I suppose it would have been more difficult to reject the car once it was registered in your name and you started using it.  The Mazda is a great car, I am sure you will enjoy your new purchase.  Mazda are a great company, once they release the new skyactive-x petrol engine, which is looking  like it could be a game changer in the sector, i will be looking at a 3 as an alternative to the new CT or UX for my wife. 

On the ES, its interesting that the US cars are also similar but it would have been nice to also have had the option to upgrade to leather on the F Sport.  It would definitely be my choice but not quite the deal breaker for me. 

The quirks of my ES continue to delight and frustrate me in equal measure, I will update this thread shortly with some latest observations. 

[PRT68]

I had an ES300h Sport as a loan car from Lexus Coventry earlier this week. I ended up having it for 48 hours. In that time I didn't really have time to explore the interior electronic systems for fear of altering something!

Agree that it is a wonderful car, and really good to drive. But, as mentioned, the seat material did not impress, and whilst the plastic trims were nice and solid, I imagine they will not look so good in 5 years time, especially if the car has an uncaring owner. You feel that even a gentle brush with a door trim will leave a scratch.

The biggest thing I did notice was the lovely smell of leather when I got back in my ISF. The ES I'm afraid just smelt of plastic.....

[fetchez la vache]

Just a quick update.

if your not in too much of a hurry, it can be a very efficient machine.

Just driven from st Albans to Newport South Wales so 150 miles or so.  Quite a bit of roadworks so stretches of 50mph and apart from that travelling 65-70mph

Wonder what I would do on the 17inch wheels? 

[Sloth]

As I am eagerly awaiting delivery of my new ES300h F Sport (F Sport White with Takumi pack) around mid July I have been reading this with interest.

The seat material does not bother me at all, I have driven the UX F Sport (Takumi pack) for a couple of weeks and it has (as far as I'm aware) the same Tahara seat material which was (in my opinion) both comfortable and attractive. I previously had a 2016 Mercedes C300h AMG Line Hybrid with their Premium Plus pack. Despite the premier plus pack it still only had their Artico synthetic leather.

I find the Lexus Tahara leather to be superior to the Artico leather that Mercedes use. It is softer, more comfortable and feels less synthetic to me.

I am also pleased to hear the the HUD has music track info as the HUD on the UX I drove did not. 

Going back to my experience (25,000 miles over 3 years) with the Mercedes C300h. I hated the RWD and will never have another. It handled like a baby Giraffe or a pig on stilts in the wet or poor surfaces and I felt it to be literally dangerous! I had previously always had FWD cars and felt them to be more stable and more planted especially around corners. I always felt I had to be careful in the Mercedes and don't get me started on it with wet and especially icy weather....it was lethal!. Most of the time I felt like my rear end wanted to get personal with my front end which is not good.

So I am confused by James' experience of the FWD handling as it is the total opposite to my last 3 years in a RWD car.

Still, a great review and it has done nothing to dampen my excitement  

[YYB129]

Good morning!

Still eagerly awaiting my September delivery, February order; I don't test drive as for me it is a little like peeking at a wrapped present 🎁.  The only time I do is when I am adding to my eclectic horde of classic vehicles.

Quiz regards connectivity. 

• Back with my 63 plate BMW 520d there was a 'Send to Car' option from Google Maps to instruct the sat nav; the car would notify you when you got to the car and ask if you wanted to use that destination, or not
• With my 66 plate C350e, there is a suite of function from a mobile device application
  • Remote departure time set, so that the car defrosts and warms or cools based on a departure time sent from a mobile anywhere in the world; like a few occasions arriving back to the UK at early hours of the morning in winter, and telling the car to be ready for 0200hrs where the heated seats are on and it is 21C inside
  • Remote monitoring of the car, including geo-cache warnings; useful for monitoring the valet parking drivers at an airport 😉
  • Remote sat nav instruction from mobile and more....

I'm waffling!

Does the ES have any such convenience functionality or Lexus App?

@fetchez la vache what further updates have you for those looking forward to our arrivals?

[Sloth]

I did ask the dealership about a Lexus App  as I also used the 'Mercedes Me' App.

They said no such App was available for Lexus as far as they knew and certainly not at present.

I'd check again though as most dealers do not seem to know everything about this sort of thing 

[Pidu]

There is Lexus Link app, do not see why it would not work with ES. Functionality is rather limited, allows to find destination and send it to the car but it is not most user friendly.
There is no preheat option on Lexus as it is not plug in hybrid, so would require ICE to idle to preheat and that I believe is against the law in the UK.

[MMCG]

I went for F-Sport for the black interior ( muddy / astroturf soccer playing children). 

I find the 19" wheels a bit hard and I had an IS lux 300h before and it was squishy on 17" wheels. Think 18" is the sweet spot. 

3000k's in and aside from a rattle from the sunroof, and some minor squeaks remaining from garage addressing said squeaks, the quality is ok.

I found the RWD IS too twitchy in the wet, and the ES drivetrain/economy/grunt far better. The electric motor does far more in the ES.

As for the fake leather? Well the real stuff looked a bit shook on the drivers bolsters after 2 years in the IS, and having had cream leather before that, so I will give fake a go.  The press notes say it is "Vegan Leather" so we can add that to the virtue signalling. 

Economy now 50mpg mixed. Which is about 50% better than wife's A6. 

I have the cheapo infotainment (Ireland loses out on that) and I have not managed to get the Lexus App store to do anything. Even when I do the WiFi thing.

Much better at  cosseting you from the world than the A6 and better looking than the IS or 5 Series. 

And being neurotic, I love the speed limit display on the dash.

Any thoughts on Lane keep assist? I think it is pointless, and it seems to track the left white line, so attempts to take exits off the motorway. 

Adaptive cruise control is wonderful though.

[DanD]

On 7/15/2019 at 10:01 AM, Pidu said:

There is no preheat option on Lexus as it is not plug in hybrid, so would require ICE to idle to preheat and that I believe is against the law in the UK.

I am not so sure. Back in the early naughties, I had a top of the range SEAT Alhambra TDI 130. It was one of the first cars to reach the UK and had extras that were not officially part of the UK spec. One of them was an auxilliary heater that could be programmed to come on at specific times via the clock. It did not require the car to idle and worked independently from the engine. It was great never to have to scrape frosted windows... especially on such a large car.

[Pidu]

I am not so sure. Back in the early naughties, I had a top of the range SEAT Alhambra TDI 130. It was one of the first cars to reach the UK and had extras that were not officially part of the UK spec. One of them was an auxilliary heater that could be programmed to come on at specific times via the clock. It did not require the car to idle and worked independently from the engine. It was great never to have to scrape frosted windows... especially on such a large car.

There are systems like this, eg. Webasto. Not on Lexus unless you get it fitted independently.

[Farqui]

Engine heaters are available for Lexus/Toyota although not as standard in the UK, I believe they are std fit in say Canada.

[MMCG]

4 hours ago, DanD said:

I am not so sure. Back in the early naughties, I had a top of the range SEAT Alhambra TDI 130. It was one of the first cars to reach the UK and had extras that were not officially part of the UK spec. One of them was an auxilliary heater that could be programmed to come on at specific times via the clock. It did not require the car to idle and worked independently from the engine. It was great never to have to scrape frosted windows... especially on such a large car.

My E90 had a ventilation timer thing. And it was a basic enough spec...

Never bothered to use it as I thought the risk of a flat Battery not worth it.