Flat Battery

[Surebet]

Wife went to take car out of the garage tonight, could not get into car. Came back to get my keys thinking Battery in remote flat, still no joy with my set, she tried boot lid and it opened, she thinks it has been left slightly open since last weekend when we last used car.  I got into the car using manual key. When tried to start, got absolutely nothing. Never had flat Battery with any car before. 

Do you think the light in the boot being on all week would flatten the Battery?.

Have jump leads however not long enough as car is nose in . Will see if I can get a loan of another set tomorrow. Any advice regarding starting with jump leads.

[Texas]

Check and double check,even triple check that you Do-Not inadvertently connect any jump or boost Battery to the wrong polarity on your Battery. Many a post on here ( and ten times more in the US!) of reverse polarity occurring and causing untold ( and £££££'s)  problems.

you may still have the factory fitted Battery and at close to 7 years old it may be getting to the end of its life and this extended deep discharge may have tipped it over the edge. You could try giving it a very long low charge ( off the car) to see if can be recovered, but expect the worst ( new 4 year G'tee Bosch should be about £80)

As for 'jump' starting a few basic's, keep engine of good car running, do-not allow cars to come into contact with each other.

Attach Positive ( + RED ) jump cable lead to + (RED) Battery terminal on 'dead' Battery and the other end of the Red cable to Positive ( +) terminal on good car/battery.

Connect Negative ( - BLACK ) jump cable to Negative ( - BLACK ) terminal on good car/battery then connect other end of Black cable onto a bolt or bracket ( Not Fuel related) on engine of dead Battery car.

Allow  at least 30 seconds before attempting to start dead car and after it (hopefully) starts then allow to idle and then turn on Headlights,Fog lights,Heated Windows and heater blower fan and then turn off 'jump' car and remove all connections in the reverse order. Then turn off lights etc.

paul m.

[Herbie]

33 minutes ago, Texas said:

and then turn on Headlights,Fog lights,Heated Windows and heater blower fan and then turn off 'jump' car

Never heard of anyone doing this before Paul, what's the reasoning behind it?

[Texas]

Got that from the Haynes Manual ( Fiat 500, but common to all manuals!) that was on coffee table in front of me!!

Reasoning I can see is this, If Battery is completely flat /defective in casualty car then jump starting Will get car going yes, but on removal of good car's Battery then casualty car may stop. So if casualty car Battery is borderline completely flat/defective then maximum electrical draw will highlight this before perhaps you drive off thinking all good after the jump start.

 

This bit of advice is now lacking from Haynes on their website 'Jump Starting How To'

https://haynes.com/en-gb/tips-tutorials/how-jump-start-car

[Surebet]

2 hours ago, Texas said:

Check and double check,even triple check that you Do-Not inadvertently connect any jump or boost battery to the wrong polarity on your battery. Many a post on here ( and ten times more in the US!) of reverse polarity occurring and causing untold ( and £££££'s)  problems.

you may still have the factory fitted battery and at close to 7 years old it may be getting to the end of its life and this extended deep discharge may have tipped it over the edge. You could try giving it a very long low charge ( off the car) to see if can be recovered, but expect the worst ( new 4 year G'tee Bosch should be about £80)

As for 'jump' starting a few basic's, keep engine of good car running, do-not allow cars to come into contact with each other.

Attach Positive ( + RED ) jump cable lead to + (RED) battery terminal on 'dead' battery and the other end of the Red cable to Positive ( +) terminal on good car/battery.

Connect Negative ( - BLACK ) jump cable to Negative ( - BLACK ) terminal on good car/battery then connect other end of Black cable onto a bolt or bracket ( Not Fuel related) on engine of dead battery car.

Allow  at least 30 seconds before attempting to start dead car and after it (hopefully) starts then allow to idle and then turn on Headlights,Fog lights,Heated Windows and heater blower fan and then turn off 'jump' car and remove all connections in the reverse order. Then turn off lights etc.

paul m.

You mentioned a 4 year G'tee Bosch Battery, where is the best place to buy Battery, most batteries appear to have only 3 year G'tee.

[Herbie]

2 hours ago, Texas said:

This bit of advice is now lacking from Haynes on their website 'Jump Starting How To'

Probably because it's completely inaccurate Paul.

The Battery is only used to crank the engine. Once the engine is running and the alternator is spinning, the alternator itself powers all electrical systems and if there's enough 'spare' capacity it also charges the Battery. Putting that extra load on will do the exact opposite of what you want to do, ie, charge the Battery.

[Texas]

Whenever I submit any info on here ( or other forums I subscribe to ) it is either from 1st hand personal experience of the last 39 years of building/repairing and maintaining vehicles of all shapes and sizes or it is from a legitimate traceable source. I myself tell my kids not to believe everything you read on the InterWeb and I would always advocate gleening info from as many sources as possible and then make you own mind up!

With regards to new Battery EuroCarParts have stores nationwide and also deliver free, they are a bit like DFS ( constantly having a SALE!) but the discount varies almost daily! Do not buy anything from ECP without a discount code of some sort because their prices are geared to be discounted. You can sign up for codes via email and the current one ' PAT75 ' gets you 45% off batteries. So a Bosch S4 068 is today gonna cost £88.54. Del.

Note: I am not affiliated in any way with ECP and other retailers are available!

some recent(ish) threads on Battery woes.

https://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/topic/118032-need-help-with-is-250-battery/

https://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/topic/107731-best-12v-battery-for-is250/

 

 

[johnnyroper]

4 hours ago, Herbie said:

Never heard of anyone doing this before Paul, what's the reasoning behind it?

It is or was recommended to reduce the risk of spiking the electronics after jump starting a dead car from a good one. 

[Herbie]

9 hours ago, Texas said:

Whenever I submit any info on here ( or other forums I subscribe to ) it is either from 1st hand personal experience of the last 39 years of building/repairing and maintaining vehicles of all shapes and sizes or it is from a legitimate traceable source. I myself tell my kids not to believe everything you read on the InterWeb and I would always advocate gleening info from as many sources as possible and then make you own mind up!

Whoa there partner, no offence meant  🙂

I, too, try to be accurate and draw on my own first-hand experiences that life has given me as well as looking for verification from other sources and it's a very good practice to do so.

In 1974 I started an apprenticeship and became a time-served, fully qualified electrician. A few years later I became interested in amateur radio so I took the City & Guilds course and became a licenced radio ham (callsign G7IFM). Although an electrician by trade the vast majority of my working life has been as a telephone engineer on BT, later having responsibility for Special Faults Investigations. Sadly, a back injury at work made it impossible to carry on doing physical work so I'm now self-employed doing computer repairs.

9 hours ago, johnnyroper said:

It is or was recommended to reduce the risk of spiking the electronics after jump starting a dead car from a good one.

Now, I can see that as an extra, though somewhat unnecessary step, but a 'belt and braces' approach isn't necessarily a bad thing. I say "unnecessary" because the Battery itself acts as a huge smoothing capacitor and would eliminate any spikes that may originate from the removal of the jumper leads.

When taking part in amateur radio competitions we would be in a tent in a field somewhere with a generator providing our electricity supply. The equipment worked on 12V but some of the genny sets gave a 'dirty' output so a car Battery was connected in between the output of the power supply and the equipment purely for that reason - to smooth out any spikes or noise and present a clean supply to the gear.

[Texas]

I too am a time served Electrician ( C&G 236  Electricial Installation ), started apprenticeship in 1980 for SWEB and ended up being 'pyro' King by the time I left in 1989 to join Fire & Rescue Service and have just retired after doing 28 years frontline firefighting there! ( ended up being HGV RTC specialist!).

So from your background you sort of knew why the electrical demand was recommend to be placed on the defective Battery car. I do not try and go 'too deep' when trying to answer people's queries on forums as I do not know their level of knowledge or their skill sets and people normally want quick/simple remedies! In my first job for example we used to work 'live' sometimes and although I would be comfortable doing that there is no way I would try to explain to someone else how to do it!!! 

Example, one poster on here ( shall remain anon) reported 'rattling noises' after 'doing' his front brake pads! Turns out after advising about caliper fixing torque levels and pad locating pins the road wheel nuts were loose! Really, how basic do you have to go when answering people's queries?

paul m.

[Herbie]

58 minutes ago, Texas said:

started apprenticeship in 1980 for SWEB and ended up being 'pyro' King

Haha, me too  😁

I served my apprenticeship at Courtaulds factory which was excellent because they had their own power station with five turbine/genny sets (two and a backup for normal 50Hz and one and a backup working at 120Hz for the box spinning machines) and 12 substations onsite. It was a brilliant apprenticeship because I could be fitting a light in an office one day and the next day I could be working on a substation feeder cable or in the power house undercutting the comm on a genny, but I digress.

The year before I started there was a big fire broke out in ducting on the roof and they were still recovering from that, installing new fire alarm systems and suchlike. Before that job was finished I'd made off 476 pyro ends!

[Surebet]

Well went down to the garage this morning armed with 2 sets of jump leads however at each lead being only approximately only 5ft long. With the car shoe horned into the garage nose in, I proceeded to make an extension jumper made of heavy duty electrical cable to bridge the distance between the 2 sets of jump leads ( a bit Heath Robinson) however with the snow falling I couldn't be bothered making my way to shop for another set of leads. Followed all advice given on forum and good news, success, car now out garage and gave it a good run this afternoon. Many thanks to all members who contributed good advice.

[Texas]

Glad you got it moving without much trouble. 

Keep an eye on the Battery now, especially if it is cold as batteries, like me, don't like cold conditions and of it starts to show signs of struggling then it might be time to replace it before getting caught out in a more awkward situation.

paul m. 

[KenMavor]

On 3/16/2019 at 10:43 PM, Texas said:

Glad you got it moving without much trouble. 

Keep an eye on the battery now, especially if it is cold as batteries, like me, don't like cold conditions and of it starts to show signs of struggling then it might be time to replace it before getting caught out in a more awkward situation.

paul m. 

Just had similar on daughter's Fiat Grande Punto...charged it up but pretty sure Battery was failing and only a year old.

Took it along to Kwik Fit and got them to do their free Battery health check....even with an overnight charge it was showing 349 amps as opposed to the 450 it should have been.  Battery health was also down to about 65%.  Took the print out and went back to EuroCarparts and they replaced without a problem.  Also started buying batteries locally as when you look at the returns procedure it's impossible to return a faulty Battery.  You need either the original box or something made up to the same spec....PITA.

[Texas]

That’s the only problem with ECP, returns from web orders is a right royal pain, have to get returns number from a phone call centre to return to a shop so best to buy over the counter if you can.