Moving to an ES

[SH20]

The GS450h I've had for 7 months has been the catalyst to the decision to buy an ES.   The GS is a great car and I believe the ES will be it's equal if not better.  The whole hybrid thing for me has been very rewarding and although it will be July before the car arrives I will miss the GS and it's outstanding  reliability.   The ES will be a keeper for me.   Black paint and Topaz interior with a Premium Pack is sufficient for me and keeps the price below £40K.  A penny over and the road tax would be £440 for Five years !!   absolute disgrace the Government  do this as just another stealth tax.  Keep the price under £40K and it's £130 a year.  

[spacenase]

Hi,

I've been waiting to hear from someone who is moving from a GS to an ES. I look forward to hearing your experiences when you get it, especially how you find the difference between a 450h and the 300h.

I don't think the new tax rules are a disgrace, the hike is too high and the threshold is too low, but it's no more unfair than other tax methods. At least it will get rid of the >£500 a year tax on a car over 10 years old worth a couple of grand that we have now.

 

[Nico72]

2 hours ago, SH20 said:

 Black paint and Topaz interior with a Premium Pack is sufficient for me and keeps the price below £40K.  A penny over and the road tax would be £440 for Five years !!   absolute disgrace the Government  do this as just another stealth tax.  Keep the price under £40K and it's £130 a year.  

I agree with you that about the stealth tax, but on the other hand it will make the car manufacturers think carefully how to price so consumers could be tempted to make a deal avoiding the £440 tax. It certainly is a bad move for Tesla, as their customers will be tempted to seek a cheaper vehicle to avoid this stealth tax either by getting a basic new model 3 or going for the S model as second hand... The tax is a bit wrong in my opinion and should have been calculated mainly according to emission rather than value price of the vehicle.

[Nico72]

1 hour ago, spacenase said:

I've been waiting to hear from someone who is moving from a GS to an ES. I look forward to hearing your experiences when you get it, especially how you find the difference between a 450h and the 300h.

 

That is a hard one to leave the 450 for a 300, additionally I think he could be missing the rear wheel drive feel with ES. In my honest opinion, I think the GS is a better built quality car overall but I do like the look of this new ES car... I am now managing 32.1 mpg driving in town (up to 30mpg) and I am very impressed given the size of this engine... Would be interested to know what the ES 300h would achieve likewise...

[Linas.P]

4 minutes ago, Nico72 said:

I agree with you that about the stealth tax, but on the other hand it will make the car manufacturers think carefully how to price so consumers could be tempted to make a deal avoiding the £440 tax. It certainly is a bad move for Tesla, as their customers will be tempted to seek a cheaper vehicle to avoid this stealth tax either by getting a basic new model 3 or going for the S model as second hand... The tax is a bit wrong in my opinion and should have been calculated mainly according to emission rather than value price of the vehicle.

Especially considering we already paying tax based on car value - it is called VAT. This is literally Robin Hood tax... of in other words robbery in the middle of the day.

[SH20]

I agree that moving from  a GS450h  3.5 litre engine to a 2.5 litre ES300h will be the biggest question I will have but as we won't get the V6 ES350h in this country it's something I will have to live with.   Apart from the obvious road tests I had recently of the ES it was hard to establish in real terms what owning one is like in all the areas that would be of interest.

Fortunately a forum member offered to let me see his ES Takumi which he's had for a few weeks now.  This was a real insight into his ownership and how useful some of the gadgetry is on a day to day basis.   Although a Takumi it still uses the same 2.5 engine and when I was driving it I got no real sense of the front wheel drive being in your face compared to the GS450h rear wheel drive. Moreover the engine in the ES300 is really powerful and pulls like a train.   Brakes were very impressive too.    There was no torque steer at all when you accelerated hard and the sound proofing must have been given a lot of attention as it was very hard to distinguish when you were in EV mode at around 30-40mph. 

I was told the mpg figures being achieved in the real world was in the mid forties which sounds really good.  The standard sun roof is a nice to have which I had on a LS460 but not on the GS.  It is a fraction under 5 metres long and it really shows in the rear leg room, much more than the GS.   The owner's car was in Sonic white with semi aniline leather in black, absolutely outstanding combination.  Bigger boot space, must be due to how the Battery is mounted.   No space saver though. I hate those inflator kits.  I have a second  steel space saver for my GS so i will be putting that in the boot after I check the 5 stud dimensions on the hub and the wheel nut profile.  I feel I now know what i should expect going forward.   There is a really great 5 min YouTube video I came across by accident titled   2019 Lexus ES  vs 2018 Lexus LS  See the differences . The  comparisons are remarkable and the ES looks like a smaller LS, maybe.  The video has had 260,000 hits. 

 

[Nico72]

31 minutes ago, SH20 said:

I agree that moving from  a GS450h  3.5 litre engine to a 2.5 litre ES300h will be the biggest question I will have but as we won't get the V6 ES350h in this country it's something I will have to live with.   Apart from the obvious road tests I had recently of the ES it was hard to establish in real terms what owning one is like in all the areas that would be of interest.

Fortunately a forum member offered to let me see his ES Takumi which he's had for a few weeks now.  This was a real insight into his ownership and how useful some of the gadgetry is on a day to day basis.   Although a Takumi it still uses the same 2.5 engine and when I was driving it I got no real sense of the front wheel drive being in your face compared to the GS450h rear wheel drive. Moreover the engine in the ES300 is really powerful and pulls like a train.   Brakes were very impressive too.    There was no torque steer at all when you accelerated hard and the sound proofing must have been given a lot of attention as it was very hard to distinguish when you were in EV mode at around 30-40mph. 

I was told the mpg figures being achieved in the real world was in the mid forties which sounds really good.  The standard sun roof is a nice to have which I had on a LS460 but not on the GS.  It is a fraction under 5 metres long and it really shows in the rear leg room, much more than the GS.   The owner's car was in Sonic white with semi aniline leather in black, absolutely outstanding combination.  Bigger boot space, must be due to how the battery is mounted.   No space saver though. I hate those inflator kits.  I have a second  steel space saver for my GS so i will be putting that in the boot after I check the 5 stud dimensions on the hub and the wheel nut profile.  I feel I now know what i should expect going forward.   There is a really great 5 min YouTube video I came across by accident titled   2019 Lexus ES  vs 2018 Lexus LS  See the differences . The  comparisons are remarkable and the ES looks like a smaller LS, maybe.  The video has had 260,000 hits. 

 

Thanks for sharing your detailed insights. No doubt it is a good car. Glad to hear that there is no real difference felt as a front wheel drive. The economy is very good. I will check this video - thanks!

[Zotto]

I was considering , driving a GS 300h, to wait and buy a new ES 300h, but at the end of my mumbling I bought a RX 450h, for 3 reasons:

I wanted to try a SUV

I thought that a ES, compared to my President GS, is more or less equivalent, some tech aids more and some finesses less

I missed a v6 engine and its power.

 

Before GS 300h I had a 2008 GS 450h, and the passage from v6 to 4 banger engine with much more less power at the beginning was a bit shocking, it seemed to me that new car was "slow" , and actually it's not true, it moves decently and with a massive spare of fuel ( from 12,5 to 16 km/l), so, be conscious that you will not find the "wow" effect you have  pressing right pedal with GS 450h , if you don' t care much about this you will have a big smile for all the rest and when fueling.

Said this, I now drive a RX 450h and like it very much, but a used ES 300h (or a LS? ) could be my next car , let's say after 2022, or may be an electric vehicle too...

 

[Dapprman]

The difference between FWD and RWD is a non starter outside of a high performance car that's being driven hard.  Before my GS I had a Citroen C6, which was front wheel drive, and was more composed when accelerating and driving, despite the drive wheels being at the wrong end (of note big Citroen have always had very good reputations for ride and passenger quality and have all been FWD since the Traction Avant).

I'm interested in seeing the differences between the two over a couple of years of ownership.  I tend to keep my cars long term and can already see my next big car being an ES (I tried a NX as a loaner when my car was in for it's annual service, and while the space was good, the engine felt weak for such a big car - not dangerous, just needing to be worked too hard for a cruiser).