A few 2001 GS300 issues

[Nails]

Hi All,

Please can someone help me with the following issues:

1. Wet passenger side rear carpet is wet, assuming sunroof drain is at fault in some way. What is the best way to tackle this?

2. Steering wheel wobble at 65mph+ doesn't seem to go away as I go faster so not sure if it is wheel balancing? Smooth as anything at 60 and below.

3. Stereo works fine but for some reason no reception at all on AM/MW?! FM is totally fine. 

4. Engine management light is on. Not causing any obvious issue so I am not overly bothered by this right now, the MOT is in August next and the garage I use have been doing my families cars for years so happy just to leave this to them when the time cars to be honest. Issues 1, 2 and 3 are more annoying, especially number 1!

Any help or advice would be much appreciated. 

Thanks
Mike

[IanA2]

Re 1 & 4:

 

1. I had water problem in my 430, garage cleared the drain pipe and all was good.

 

2. EML can be reset, but can also be caused by loose/ill fitting/worn seal  petrol cap. To reset short pins 4 & 13 to clear.

 

Hth.

 

Ian

 

 

 

 

  

[Nails]

4 hours ago, IanA2 said:

Re 1 & 4:

 

1. I had water problem in my 430, garage cleared the drain pipe and all was good.

 

2. EML can be reset, but can also be caused by loose/ill fitting/worn seal  petrol cap. To reset short pins 4 & 13 to clear.

 

Hth.

 

Ian

 

 

 

 

  

Thanks Ian. I will investigate the drains as soon as I get a chance, problem is I am at work during daylight hours so it will have to wait until the weekend. Any ideas how to clear the drains? I was thinking coat hanger but won't it potentially pierce the tubes and cause more trouble?

Regarding re-setting the EML by shorting pins 4 and 13, where can I find it and what should I use to short it? Just a paper clip? Sorry for noob questions. 

[IanA2]

You could try blowing air down the tubes. I did, didn't work and I got my local garage to do it for me, never asked how. Probably wouldn't use a coat hanger. A few how to vids on youtube iirc.

 

Iirc it's in the side of the d/s footwell. It's a few years since I did mine. I used a paperclip with insulated pliers. Try messing with the fuel cap, you may be surprised.

 

 

[Nails]

Hi all. Leak sorted, it was the sunroof drains. 

New problem, EML light flashing and engine mis firing. Also, the VSC light came on after these problems started as well. Any ideas?

[BachelorDays]

It's so annoying when a car you've just bought starts coming up with 'surprises'.

You've had it for about a month so you'll have a good feel for how it behaves notwithstanding the current issues and whether you feel it'll probably throw up other things. 

A wheel bearing might be giving you trouble on the 65mph+ wobble. The EML might be a MAF. The rusted sunroof frame is a compromise.

The good thing is you've got a garage you trust. I think the entire list is likely to be diagnosed within an hour or so with the right tools and know-how. You will then be in a much better position to decide your next steps.

All the best.

[Nails]

4 hours ago, BachelorDays said:

It's so annoying when a car you've just bought starts coming up with 'surprises'.

You've had it for about a month so you'll have a good feel for how it behaves notwithstanding the current issues and whether you feel it'll probably throw up other things. 

A wheel bearing might be giving you trouble on the 65mph+ wobble. The EML might be a MAF. The rusted sunroof frame is a compromise.

The good thing is you've got a garage you trust. I think the entire list is likely to be diagnosed within an hour or so with the right tools and know-how. You will then be in a much better position to decide your next steps.

All the best.

It seems now that the drains are clear not enough water gets passed the sunroof seal to cause a problem, what water does goes down the drain hole and not into the car. At least undernatural rain conditions, I certainly wont be power hosing around the sunroof anytime soon.

The EML light is flashing along with a miss fire, then the blinking vsc lights came on. Not impressed. 

[The-Acre]

45 minutes ago, Nails said:

It seems now that the drains are clear not enough water gets passed the sunroof seal to cause a problem, what water does goes down the drain hole and not into the car. At least undernatural rain conditions, I certainly wont be power hosing around the sunroof anytime soon.

The EML light is flashing along with a miss fire, then the blinking vsc lights came on. Not impressed. 

A diagnostic is the only way to discover the EML problem, even a cheap (£20) one should do it.  Many cheap diagnostic devices come with a long list of generic fault codes which will help identify the problem.  As far as drain hole unblocking goes, a long length of industrial strimmer line works a treat. Not the stuff you have for a cheap Flymo but the heavy duty stuff 4mm thick. Don't get too despondent, the EML may turn out to be something simple.

Where in Sussex are you?

[TigerFish]

Misfire could be something as simple as a service item like a spark plug. For the life of me I can’t remember the cool pack and plug lead config on my old gen 2. I seem to recall one pack fires two plugs, so you may be able to swap the packs a out to see if the dodgy cylinder(s) moves.

As mentioned, a cheap code reader is invaluable, the one I’ve got you select the manufacturer, and it gives the full description for any codes read.


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[ColinBarber]

13 minutes ago, TigerFish said:

For the life of me I can’t remember the cool pack and plug lead config on my old gen 2. I seem to recall one pack fires two plugs, so you may be able to swap the packs a out to see if the dodgy cylinder(s) moves.

I believe there are six coils, one next to each cylinder, with short HT leads to the plugs rather than integrated coil packs.

[TigerFish]

I believe there are six coils, one next to each cylinder, with short HT leads to the plugs rather than integrated coil packs.

 

Doing some googling, it does look like there are three coil packs. Direct onto 3 plugs, and then an HT lead onto the other 3 (1 from each pack).

 

 

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[ColinBarber]

13 minutes ago, TigerFish said:

 

Doing some googling, it does look like there are three coil packs. Direct onto 3 plugs, and then an HT lead onto the other 3 (1 from each pack).

Yes you are correct, quite a weird design.

[The-Acre]

1 hour ago, TigerFish said:

 

Doing some googling, it does look like there are three coil packs. Direct onto 3 plugs, and then an HT lead onto the other 3 (1 from each pack).

 

 

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So this is a straight 6?

[i-s]

1 hour ago, TigerFish said:

Doing some googling, it does look like there are three coil packs. Direct onto 3 plugs, and then an HT lead onto the other 3 (1 from each pack).

 

 

1 hour ago, ColinBarber said:

Yes you are correct, quite a weird design.

 

It's not that unusual for the time.... my 1998 Mitsubishi Galant 2.0 had the same setup (albeit 2 packs and 2 ht leads). 

It's called "wasted spark" ignition. The coil pack is energised and fires both plugs attached to it once per crank revolution - for one cylinder it fires at the end of the compression stroke (as expected), and the other cylinder fires at the end of the exhaust stroke (the "wasted" spark) - each coil is attached to the two cylinders that move together. 

In other words, if you look at this animation: 

Then a wasted spark ignition would have one pack for cylinders 1&6, one for 2&5 and one for 3&4. 

The wasted spark is harmless - there is no fuel mixture in the cylinder to ignite (in fact, as it occurs at the end of the exhaust stroke, there's very little at all in the cylinder), other than it halves the wear life of the spark plugs (but given that platinum and iridium spark plugs were becoming commonplace at the same time as wasted spark ignition, this was not problematic). The benefit to it, of course, is that it halves the number of expensive coil packs required, while still offering a distributorless ignition. The very short HT leads employed on wasted spark setups tended to better reliability than the longer HT leads of a distributor setup (to say nothing of the poor reliability of distributors themselves). 

These days individual coil packs have become commonplace and commoditised such that there's no point in the wasted spark system anymore, but it was not that unusual in the 90s into 2000s. 

 

[TigerFish]

So this is a straight 6?

 

Beaten to it above

 

 

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[Nails]

20 hours ago, The-Acre said:

A diagnostic is the only way to discover the EML problem, even a cheap (£20) one should do it.  Many cheap diagnostic devices come with a long list of generic fault codes which will help identify the problem.  As far as drain hole unblocking goes, a long length of industrial strimmer line works a treat. Not the stuff you have for a cheap Flymo but the heavy duty stuff 4mm thick. Don't get too despondent, the EML may turn out to be something simple.

Where in Sussex are you?

I am in Crawley,

The car is currently with a local garage to look into the EML and miss fire. 

[The-Acre]

3 hours ago, Nails said:

I am in Crawley,

The car is currently with a local garage to look into the EML and miss fire. 

Keep us posted re the result, it'll be helpful to others in the future. If you'd been closer I could have plugged you in to mine, I'm down on the coast.

[TigerFish]

I’d still recommend getting a cheap reader. Even if you’re not handy with the spanners, it’s still useful to be armed with some info when it goes into a garage with “issues”.


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[Nails]

Ok, looks like I am going to sell the car for spares/repair or take it to the scrap yard. It needs all 3 ignition coils, these are about 200 quid each. Plus labour, plus potentially leads and plugs as well. I am going to be looking at upwards of £800. 

The code reader is reading misfires across 4 of the 6 cylinders, the 4 cylinders affected are not across 2 coils but all 3. The code reader says it is the coils, but the garage said it might end up needing leads and plugs as well. The bloke I use is very honest and he said if it were him he would just run it until it dies, scrap it, sell it for spares etc. His advice is it is not worth spending this amount of money on and I am inclined to agree with him. 

If it was really easy to take it all apart and inspect all the coils to see what is going on I would get him to, but it sounds like it is quite a bit of labour to get to all this stuff and I don't want to throw any money at this car unless there is a guaranteed fix. 

If anybody wants a cheap Lexus GS300 for spares give me a shout, or if anyone knows where I can get coils for this car much cheaper let me know! The garage said he tried everywhere and the only place he could get the right ones was Lexus, hence the cost. His parts people sent him two lots of pattern coils but they are not the same. 

[Farqui]

At least you know now what the issues are and where to focus your attention.

For the coils, have you checked on RockAuto.com? 

To be certain I usually double check the part numbers on the likes of 7Zap.

[Nails]

3 hours ago, Farqui said:

At least you know now what the issues are and where to focus your attention.

For the coils, have you checked on RockAuto.com? 

To be certain I usually double check the part numbers on the likes of 7Zap.

Have you ordered from rock auto? It all seems to come from America so shipping will take a while and it will cost a bit. Thanks for the advice though as I have managed to source pattern coils much cheaper from a UK website so perhaps the car is not dead after all!

[Farqui]

Yes i've used RockAuto several times before and 3 days shipping was as quick as a local stealer supplied parts 😉 

Glad to hear that you found a local supplier tho.

[ColinBarber]

Why would multiple coil packs fail at once? It doesn't happen.

If you get misfire readings randomly across different cylinders then it is typically an air leak or fuelling issue that causes the ECU to 'detect' is a miss.

If it is an error that is consistent with a certain cylinder then it is more typically a coil pack / plug.

[Nails]

10 hours ago, ColinBarber said:

Why would multiple coil packs fail at once? It doesn't happen.

If you get misfire readings randomly across different cylinders then it is typically an air leak or fuelling issue that causes the ECU to 'detect' is a miss.

If it is an error that is consistent with a certain cylinder then it is more typically a coil pack / plug.

I am no mechanic but there are a few reasons. Firstly in this instance, when the garage took the plastic cover off he found loads of damp debris in the area, and when I say loads he said he had not seen anything like it. The previous owner did have the car laid up for long period of time. Perhaps it was sat under a tree? Anyway I think his theory is that this debris has in someway damaged the plugs/leads/coils as he cannot find any other cause. His code reader says it is a coil miss fire. He has cleared the codes several times and they come back each time on the same 4 cylinders. I could take the car off him now and sell it for spares or repairs and he wouldn't charge me a bean. Or I can go with the theory that clearing out all the debris and changing the plugs, leads and coils will solve the issue. What would you do? I have sourced coils which would now bring the total cost of this work to more like 300 quid? Worth a punt or good money after bad?

[The-Acre]

11 minutes ago, Nails said:

I am no mechanic but there are a few reasons. Firstly in this instance, when the garage took the plastic cover off he found loads of damp debris in the area, and when I say loads he said he had not seen anything like it. The previous owner did have the car laid up for long period of time. Perhaps it was sat under a tree? Anyway I think his theory is that this debris has in someway damaged the plugs/leads/coils as he cannot find any other cause. His code reader says it is a coil miss fire. He has cleared the codes several times and they come back each time on the same 4 cylinders. I could take the car off him now and sell it for spares or repairs and he wouldn't charge me a bean. Or I can go with the theory that clearing out all the debris and changing the plugs, leads and coils will solve the issue. What would you do? I have sourced coils which would now bring the total cost of this work to more like 300 quid? Worth a punt or good money after bad?

Could the debris be caused by mice, especially if its been laid up?  Mice also love to chew their way through wiring.