ISF replacement added to the list...

[FTBBCVoodoo]

Just spent an hour driving this around.

It is my mates courtesy car while his ISF bumper gets resprayed.

I take back everything I say about BMW and get why @Warrington guy made the change.

I need one.  Now.

Absolute weapon and the noise....  Oh the noise 🙂

[Stuno1]

Care to share what you liked and didn’t like? Be good to get your thoughts. 

[LiggyL]

I've driven a friends E92 M3 (Stage 2 tune - 450bhp) a few times, and for the first time at the weekend back to back with the ISF. Still prefer the ISF although the M3 is slightly quicker with that extra ~1k rpm ish and higher peak power figure. I wonder how the M4 compares 🙂

[FTBBCVoodoo]

13 minutes ago, Stuno1 said:

Care to share what you liked and didn’t like? Be good to get your thoughts. 

Well looks aside as they are subjective (Yas Marina Blue is my favourite BMW colour).

Obviously a lot newer car than my 10 year old ISF.

So M4 Comp Pack....

Likes...

Noise.  Fitted with Performance exhaust.  Lovely loud barks on upshifts and on overrun it crackles and pops not unlike an F-Type

Steering response.  Tried all 3 modes I could find - Comfort, S & S+ and the car felt lovely in all modes.  Just nice weight to the steering and great steering feel.

Driving position.  ***** to the Grass as it should be and the seats are so much nicer than the ISF arm chairs

Power.  Didnt feel quicker than the ISF (although my friend thinks it does) but just seems a lot more savage in it's delivery.  Was in S+ at time.  Didn't boot it around in comfort mode as time/life was too short.

It turns heads.  A lot of heads :-)

DCT Gearbox - Felt a lot more punchy when upshifting (I dialled the speed up to max) although didn't feel noticeably quicker than ISF gearbox but we are talking milliseconds at the end of the day.  Both the M4 DCT and ISF change gear quicker than I could in a manual.

Dislikes....

The wheels.  Really not a fan of the Competition Pack wheels as I think they are too busy but again that is subjective.

Would take me a year to work out best settings to drive in 😉

Would be paranoid it would break 😞

[Stuno1]

Major concern is depreciation compared to the rcf if buying both at 35k ish. 

[Linas.P]

Well... nothing new, BMW are ultimate drivers machines, nothing comes close to steering feel and directness...

What about materials and interiour built quality? The only one I tried was a month old and 800 miles when I got it (not M3 though) and it was paradise of squeakiness and very cheaper very hard plastics, hard very grainy slippery leather and overall felt cheap. Other thing - body at least on ordinary 3 series lacks stiffness e.g. going of the kerb at 45 degrees you can feel and hear body flex - my mechanic even shown me where BMW left gaps in panels to account for the flex. I guess M3 is stiffened.. just wonder whenever you found it not to be as stiff?

I understand when focus is on power and driving dynamics, things I noted above takes back seat, but for daily driving I found it nowhere near in terms of luxury and premium feel (what a surprise).

[FTBBCVoodoo]

@Linas.P This has 7k miles on the clock on an 18 plate and no rattles or squeaks.  It is a hire car as well so expect it hasn't had the easiest life but all fine it would seem.

I didn't attempt to drive off any curbs so can't comment on that but car felt very stiff in the modes I tried.

Ps.  It's an M4 Comp Pack not an M3 so probably stiffer still being a 2 door.

[Northern isf]

32 minutes ago, FTBBCVoodoo said:

Would be paranoid it would break 😞

That's the only thing putting me off had a few m cars and they weren't the best reliability wise, on the other hand your only here once so...

[Flytvr]

1 hour ago, LiggyL said:

I've driven a friends E92 M3 (Stage 2 tune - 450bhp) a few times, and for the first time at the weekend back to back with the ISF. Still prefer the ISF although the M3 is slightly quicker with that extra ~1k rpm ish and higher peak power figure. I wonder how the M4 compares 🙂

M4 v ISF / GSF, from what I’ve seen on the road.....in a straight line drag, the M4 is faster - no doubt. The M4 has a major advantage with torque, so if you were up against one, you’ll have to work harder and rev your F - not necessarily a bad thing.

Mix in some wet weather and the advantage goes to the F massively. I also suspect the average driver could push an F more comfortably than an M4.

Like I said - these are my observations after seeing several F cars following an M4.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Flytvr said:

 The M4 has a major advantage with torque,

Can you explain this advantage please? 

[LiggyL]

Can you explain this advantage please? 

Instant, lower RPM torque and also higher peak figures with it being (twin) turbocharged I'd imagine

[Flytvr]

Just now, LiggyL said:

12 minutes ago, Comedian said:

Can you explain this advantage please? 

Instant, lower RPM torque and also higher peak figures with it being (twin) turbocharged I'd imagine

Pretty much Ryan 👍

However, I suspect Sean's question is loaded 😊

[Guest]

Peak figure differs by 17 lb-ft - you can do that with 2 fingers on a spanner.

The M4 peak torque starts at 1850 rpm iirc so that gives us a BHP of 143 at 1850

The RCF at 1850 is making about 123BHP

Not a huge difference but that 20 bhp down and is also pulling an extra 200kg

However, if we use our gearboxes correctly and start the race at rcf peak torque too we'd have 350bhp on tap

So for a fair "Engine" race the BMW should be at 4527 rpm and the RCF at 4800 rpm (BMW should still win due to weight) but here redline and gear spacing come into play too. Or just go past 155 and win the day for Lexus 

So in conclusion it's major advantage is weight - the rest is subjective depending how you use the car, how much traction their is etc etc to keep selling magazines to very large children ad-infinitum .

[Flytvr]

16 minutes ago, Comedian said:

Peak figure differs by 17 lb-ft - you can do that with 2 fingers on a spanner.

The M4 peak torque starts at 1850 rpm iirc so that gives us a BHP of 143 at 1850

The RCF at 1850 is making about 123BHP

Not a huge difference but that 20 bhp down and is also pulling an extra 200kg

However, if we use our gearboxes correctly and start the race at rcf peak torque too we'd have 350bhp on tap

So for a fair "Engine" race the BMW should be at 4527 rpm and the RCF at 4800 rpm (BMW should still win due to weight) but here redline and gear spacing come into play too. Or just go past 155 and win the day for Lexus 

So in conclusion it's major advantage is weight - the rest is subjective depending how you use the car, how much traction their is etc etc to keep selling magazines to very large children ad-infinitum .

Like I said - loaded

[Stuno1]

Would/could you cross countries comfortably on an M4 like you can in the rcf? Was it stiff and twitchy to the point of becoming tiresome for the gt elements of a journey? 

[tomRCFcarbon]

15 minutes ago, Comedian said:

However, if we use our gearboxes correctly

Absolutely - having 8 gears vs 7 in the BMW makes up for the difference in torques in the real world...

 

2 hours ago, FTBBCVoodoo said:

Oh the noise 🙂

Agreed, but only at full tilt. At pootling speeds it sounds like a tart farting - i couldn't live with it. The burble of the Lexus V8 when wafting around car parks is one of the most satisfying noises I can think of. As far as the aural acrobatics of popping on over run, again they would drive me mad after a while - especially knowing they are computer generated pops (you can have the ECU reprogrammed to make 3, 4 or 5 pops - its called the Rice Krispie setting!).

My impression was that the M4 is a bit like a Bose stereo - initially exciting and impressive, but so edgy and over-wrought that it becomes tiring/impossible to live with. In some ways this is why they review so well (that and all the money they give journalists)...on the other hand Lexus' choice of a Mark Levinson hi-fi in the car provides us with the most fitting metaphor - something for the aficionado to enjoy, not know by many on the street, not initially as exciting, not as attention grabbing, but fundamentally better in almost every way (IMHO!).

Coincidentally these amps retail for about the same money as a second hand RCF: https://www.stereophile.com/content/mark-levinson-no536-monoblock-power-amplifier

[FTBBCVoodoo]

@tomRCFcarbon by Mark Levinson you mean Samsung 😉

[Guest]

43 minutes ago, Flytvr said:

Like I said - loaded

Just politely disagreeing with you, sir 

[tomRCFcarbon]

1 hour ago, FTBBCVoodoo said:

@tomRCFcarbon by Mark Levinson you mean Samsung 😉

I guess so. But only as much as a Hublot is a Louis Vuitton watch. A Porsche is a VW. A Rolls Royce is a Beemer. Costa Coffee is a Coca-Cola. etc etc. 

[FTBBCVoodoo]

3 hours ago, Stuno1 said:

Would/could you cross countries comfortably on an M4 like you can in the rcf? Was it stiff and twitchy to the point of becoming tiresome for the gt elements of a journey? 

I have driven a DC2 Integra Type R across Europe.  The M4 is like a Maybach compared to that 😉

It was only twitchy when accelerating hard from a standstill or lowish speed.  Not a handful.  Just right amount of fun.

Should imagine on a long journey in comfort mode it would be a wonderful GT car.

[Stuno1]

27 minutes ago, FTBBCVoodoo said:

I have driven a DC2 Integra Type R across Europe.  The M4 is like a Maybach compared to that 😉

It was only twitchy when accelerating hard from a standstill or lowish speed.  Not a handful.  Just right amount of fun.

Should imagine on a long journey in comfort mode it would be a wonderful GT car.

Cheers. I keep thinking about them but don’t fancy the styling from exterior or interior perspective. Also, they are pretty common compared to the rcf and it will likely depreciate more than an equivelant rcf. Basically I consider it and then remember why I don’t like it! 

Eaxh to their own 👍

[Warrington guy]

Stuno1 test drive one . Like FTBBCVoodoo says you might be very surpised

[Flytvr]

4 minutes ago, Warrington guy said:

Stuno1 test drive one . Like FTBBCVoodoo says you might be very surpised

Just make sure you have clean skids with you.

And have you got breakdown cover?

😜

[Warrington guy]

Flytvr. Says a man that after a C63 😜

[Flytvr]

19 minutes ago, Warrington guy said:

Flytvr. Says a man that after a C63 😜

Just because I renewed my AA cover / garage fire insurance doesn’t mean I’m buying a German car!!!!