Bit of ICE advice...

[FuntimePhil]

Hi All, Im rejoining the clan after a few years away. Looking at a IS220 2008ish. Question is 1) do the standard readio head units have Bluetooth in as ive seen one that says Phone on the display and 2) is it possible to swap out the old headunit for the satnav version?

[Linas.P]

Standard radio unit doesn't have phone integration, sat nav unit doesn't have phone integration either. I might be wrong, but phone integration came around 2009 together with SE-i model and should be present in 2009 and later SE-L, Advance, F-Sport models with multi-media.

Multimedia can be retrofitted at astronomical cost which will be above what the car is worth (specifically ~2008 IS220d), secondly Lexus sat-nav is so terrible that I don't understand why one would want to have it, never mind pay money for it. I have had updated version of sat-nav in my 2012 F-Sport - turned it on, confirmed it works - never touched it again. The cheapest smartphone on the market will run circles around it. I do understand however that it can be useful for hands free, but equally you can just get £20 hands free kit which will work just as well.

In summary, if you really need sat-nav with phone integration - make sure you get 2009+ car with sat-nav already fitted, retrofitting it will not be economically viable.

Second thing - I am sure you have done your research, but are you sure about IS220d? You know about all potential issues? 

[FuntimePhil]

Thank you for your advice, ill leave the Satnav. Yes ive researched and im aware of the problems, specifically the head gasket that worries me. I do a lot of miles though so was worried the 250 would kill me in fuel.

Regarding the 220, they dont all pop do they? Is it a case of when not if?

[Linas.P]

There are more - DPF/ERG issues.. even turbos, injectors/5th injector issue, DMF/Clutch issues.

Generally, speaking if you do a lot of miles and all motorway - you should be OK. If you do a lot of miles and they all city, then do not touch modern diesel as then it certainly becomes the case of "when not if" (that is not only Lexus issues). I guess what compounds it for IS220d is that it was only available with rather strange 6 speed manual gearboxes, rather then indestructible autos and had head issues on top of normal diesel issues.

The answer would be to get later model IS200d, which has de-tuned engine with 150hp instead of 177hp and upgraded head-gasket. Still not good for the city.

As for IS250 fuel consumption, that is mostly an issue if you are in start stop traffic - on motorway IS250 have very reasonable consumption, not exactly match for IS220d, but as well no issues with ULEZ. Diesel now being on average 4p more expensive and going forward probably more can potentially offset any gain for you.

[FuntimePhil]

Well you have definitely give me something to think about. I do about 500 miles a week and nearly all motorway and i drive quick so hopefully lots of issues i wont see.  Am i right in thinking 90k on a IS200d should be ok with full service history? If its got that far surely its ok?

[normski2]

Please get an extended warranty on any Lexus diesel. It will give you peace of mind and save you thousands if the head goes.

I had a 220d with 90 on the clock and FLSH. Went pop inside 6 weeks. I was covered by Lexus, but I saw the bill and it was £4600.

Test drive as many as you can, see how you find the gearbox and see what mpg is displayed. Oh and forget 6th gear , I found it utterly useless unless you are doing 90mph+ which obviously you shouldn't be!! 

 

[Linas.P]

38 minutes ago, FuntimePhil said:

Well you have definitely give me something to think about. I do about 500 miles a week and nearly all motorway and i drive quick so hopefully lots of issues i wont see.  Am i right in thinking 90k on a IS200d should be ok with full service history? If its got that far surely its ok?

Yes.. the only issue - how do you know that previous owner kept it on same diet i.e. if it was run mainly in city the damage might be done already. That is especially true with cheaper older examples.

You don't need to worry about IS200d as much as you would about IS220d, in fact I haven't see any issue reported specifically for 200d... most of the issues are with 220d. If possible extended warranty would be additional safety, other thing if it is FLSH, then engines were covered for 140k head-gasket failures.

And agree with @normski2 6th gear is not suitable for UK, maybe not 90+, but certainly I would not use it below 70-75MPH. If you stick it into 6th at 70MPH and turn autopilot ON it will struggle even on the small hills and you will have to change to 5th to prevent it from almost stalling.

[Shaunomercy]

I would add carbon build up in the turbos is another issue, along with swirl chamber flaps in the induction manifold. Tho I don't know if the Lexus has the flaps.

But...

I've just traded my trusty 2.2hdi twin turbo pug. Whilst it's given me 8 years, 100,000 miles of reliable running, it has had twice yearly oil and filters. Every second oil change was a full service.

Traded in with 121,000 on it's back.

 

However over the last 6 months I've had countless depolution errors and the car has gone into limp mode for 24hrs before clearing the fault itself and running normal again.

The issue... Carbon build up on the turbo variable vanes... Every so often it would stick and cause the overboost error.

And that car was effectively serviced 4 times in the time period Peugeot specified for 1 service.

 

We do have a euro 5 Passat diesel alltrack 177bhp. That is so up and down on its fuel economy that I suspect the lex will at least match that too. And no I've not let vw anywhere near it as most report a drop in economy after the fix

 

I'm new to the Lexus fold but on my run up the motorway, the is250 matched the pug at 37.9mpg. fuel economy on the pug was always around that figure.

 

Went skegvegas Sunday and traffic was heavy and still achieved 34.3mpg with 4 of us in the car.

 

If you want diesel, go new and get one on PCP. Once the cars out of manufactures warranty your living with a liability imho.

1000 quid for an injector. High pressure fuel pump prices... Well you might need a cold compress on your head.

 

Paul.

 

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[baviaannl]

I don't get the criticism of the built in Sat Nav, once you've configured the views correctly, it works as well as any other system I've used and hasn't let me down once.  I do think its better since I purchased the latest maps though.

[Linas.P]

14 minutes ago, baviaannl said:

I don't get the criticism of the built in Sat Nav, once you've configured the views correctly, it works as well as any other system I've used and hasn't let me down once.  I do think its better since I purchased the latest maps though.

If you just need general direction where to go i.e. London to Glasgow - yes it will show general direction. For that I don't need sat-nav I would just follow road signs, the Sat-Nav for me is only for showing traffic jams etc. so I can avoid them - obviously built in sat-nav rarely have this function and even when it does it doesn't work as good as say google maps or any maps app you can get on the phone. So that applies to all built in sat-nav - I consider them all useless.

When it comes specifically to early IS mk2 sat-nav pre-2009 that as well had part-postcode entry which would take you to approximate location, whilst say iDrive on BMW from same year had full postcode entry and generally more intuitive interface. But even later IS mk2 sat-nav is in my opinion "clumsy" at best. I had 2012 version with HDD and still considered it sub-par... but don't take everything I say literally - as I would say same about latest sat-nav in RC - clumsy, unintuitive, slow, difficult to navigate and phone app would run circles around it.

The point here I guess is that phone apps are so good, not that built in sat-navs that bad.

[Wisty]

23 hours ago, Linas.P said:

The point here I guess is that phone apps are so good, not that built in sat-navs that bad.

Precisely this.  I can tell Google maps where to take me without having to touch my phone and it will guide me to within meters of that place.  Most car sat navs (even things like Garmins or Tom Toms) just aren't as good as that.  Particularly when it comes to routing around traffic.

[FuntimePhil]

Well im sorry to say, you've put me off, gutted! the 250 is just too thirsty for my miles. I brought a MAzda 6 2.2 instead and so far after 300 miles im averaging at 55mpg. 

In terms of sat navs, i do agree phones are better, i just like the aesthetics of a built in one. My old vauxhall vectra had a awful looking sat nav in it, no post code entry so was bit crap on A roads but the traffic alerts were better than most phone apps ive tried. Each to their own i guess.