Dipped headlights

[iwonder]

1 hour ago, rayaans said:

 

I know the difference between legal aspects and the MOT. 

Many LED sidelights do fail their MOT and the reason they put down is "Incorrect colour" or something along the lines of that. The machines tend to show the light output as blue despite the LED looking white to the eye and you won't even notice a blue tinge. Some bulbs may get away with it, most don't as plenty of modded used cars (particularly of the VW Golf and Audi A3) etc seem to have come up with these failure reasons on MOT. I wouldn't doubt that some centres put down that the headlight adjustment is incorrect if using LED bulbs as the dipped beam.

"It might well be illegal in the eyes of the law but MOT isn't the law" 

The above statement doesn't make sense - if the MOT is failed, you're breaking the law and you're not insured..... albeit for a brief period of time.

To aid other readers, i'll list the failures that you can have, which relate to sidelights.
Sidelights;
'inoperative or less than 50%of the light sources illuminating'
'obscured so that less than 50% of the lamp illuminating surface is visible from the front or rear as appropriate'
'not visible from a reasonable distance due to excessive damage, deterioration, or having products on the lens or light source'
'shows a light other than red to the rear and white to the front(or yellow if a front position lamp is incorporated in a yellow headlamp) ' Note:  Some front position lamps have a blue tinge to the light.  This is acceptable provided the light is predominantly white.

Dipped lights;
'inoperative, excessively damaged or deteriorated or has a product on the lens or light source so that the light output is well below that required to illuminate the road ahead'
'an obligatory headlamp shows light that is not substantially white or yellow'
'do not emit light of the samecolour'
'A headlamp which does not conform to diagrams 1, 2 or 3 that has a beam image which is aimed so that it dazzles other road users.' dip beam headlamps are aimed so they do not dazzle, ie the beam image brightest part is aimed at least 0.5% below the horizontal
'Projected beam image obviously incorrect, e.g. where the headlamp bulb is incorrectly fitted or the reflector is seriously corroded'

So to clear up, sidelights are not tested with a machine. If it looks mostly white, it will pass. Only output failure available to the testers is related to dimming of the light.
Dipped beams can fail on dazzle, which is judged by a machine between to markers. If it fails, they can be adjusted down/up/left/right to become an MOT pass.

The biggest reason for LEDs failing is because people buy the type which are blue, or has a blue tint. Although it may be predominantly white, it will look blue to a tester that sees yellow/white bulbs every day.

Car insurance tend to include in their Ts and Cs that the car must have valid MOT, so I agree on that.

A prime example of a car passing an MOT but not being roadworthy/legal window tinting. Ting the front windows and its an MOT pass. drive out on the road with your freshly made MOT certificate and you will get pulled by police.
Legally you need to have a catalytic converter if fitted from factory, hybrids don't get a full emissions test therefore looking if it has a CAT isn't actually listed as an inspection procedure. 
You can have several aftermarket front lights if you really wanted. They are not part of the inspection so would be overlooked, but you can get pulled for that too.
These examples are what i mean when I say the MOT test is the bare minimum but your car can still be illegal.

[rayaans]

1 hour ago, iwonder said:

To aid other readers, i'll list the failures that you can have, which relate to sidelights.
Sidelights;
'inoperative or less than 50%of the light sources illuminating'
'obscured so that less than 50% of the lamp illuminating surface is visible from the front or rear as appropriate'
'not visible from a reasonable distance due to excessive damage, deterioration, or having products on the lens or light source'
'shows a light other than red to the rear and white to the front(or yellow if a front position lamp is incorporated in a yellow headlamp) ' Note:  Some front position lamps have a blue tinge to the light.  This is acceptable provided the light is predominantly white.

Dipped lights;
'inoperative, excessively damaged or deteriorated or has a product on the lens or light source so that the light output is well below that required to illuminate the road ahead'
'an obligatory headlamp shows light that is not substantially white or yellow'
'do not emit light of the samecolour'
'A headlamp which does not conform to diagrams 1, 2 or 3 that has a beam image which is aimed so that it dazzles other road users.' dip beam headlamps are aimed so they do not dazzle, ie the beam image brightest part is aimed at least 0.5% below the horizontal
'Projected beam image obviously incorrect, e.g. where the headlamp bulb is incorrectly fitted or the reflector is seriously corroded'

So to clear up, sidelights are not tested with a machine. If it looks mostly white, it will pass. Only output failure available to the testers is related to dimming of the light.
Dipped beams can fail on dazzle, which is judged by a machine between to markers. If it fails, they can be adjusted down/up/left/right to become an MOT pass.

The biggest reason for LEDs failing is because people buy the type which are blue, or has a blue tint. Although it may be predominantly white, it will look blue to a tester that sees yellow/white bulbs every day.

Car insurance tend to include in their Ts and Cs that the car must have valid MOT, so I agree on that.

A prime example of a car passing an MOT but not being roadworthy/legal window tinting. Ting the front windows and its an MOT pass. drive out on the road with your freshly made MOT certificate and you will get pulled by police.
Legally you need to have a catalytic converter if fitted from factory, hybrids don't get a full emissions test therefore looking if it has a CAT isn't actually listed as an inspection procedure. 
You can have several aftermarket front lights if you really wanted. They are not part of the inspection so would be overlooked, but you can get pulled for that too.
These examples are what i mean when I say the MOT test is the bare minimum but your car can still be illegal.

Why would Lexus fail LED sidelights then if they look white? They wouldn't just do it for the sake of it. Blue ones are pretty easy to spot but if you take a look on nearly all the car forums - MOT examiners regularly fail sidelights than are white in colour with no blue tint

[iwonder]

40 minutes ago, rayaans said:

Why would Lexus fail LED sidelights then if they look white? They wouldn't just do it for the sake of it. Blue ones are pretty easy to spot but if you take a look on nearly all the car forums - MOT examiners regularly fail sidelights than are white in colour with no blue tint

I answered this already.
"The biggest reason for LEDs failing is because people buy the type which are blue, or has a blue tint. Although it may be predominantly white, it will look blue to a tester that sees yellow/white bulbs every day."
If your LED is white with a slight blue tint it is an MOT pass, problem is not everyone reads the manual. The reasons for rejection are listed but not the notes, which have to be looked up. If you point them to the note 'Some front position lamps have a blue tinge to the light.  This is acceptable provided the light is predominantly white.' to the examiner and requested to appeal the decision. I guarantee you will end up with a MOT pass and the MOT tester learning the rules. The philips blue tinted sidelight bulbs are a perfect example of this issue and they are not LED. They sometimes get failures for incorrect colour but are 100% legal and an MOT pass.

[iwonder]

On 17/11/2017 at 9:23 AM, Fireblade1 said:

how does,that,work if you got four,bald tyres you won't get an advisory you'll get a fail

Apologies, i missed this.
You can advise anything. It is a manual operation and doesn't give options only like the reason for rejection section. You can advise tyres are illegal if you really wanted to even though you failed them. It's up to the tester to advise what they feel the customer should be aware of.