Bikers vs. Drivers and smoked mirrors (story)

[Linas.P]

3 hours ago, doog442 said:

You need to understand that you don't own the road in your V6 204 bhp metal box.  (I chucked that in because for some reason you think the size of your engine relates to your entitlement to progress down a road ).

If that is the only point you were able to extract from my post then I guess discussion ends here. To be honest it should have ended long ago starting from the point where you stated "that I need to get gasp of my surroundings" if my mirrors gets vandalised ... and that was your first post. I must admit it is my own fault to continue discussing this topic with you where you are clearly just coming here to troll. 

I clearly stated it was satire... just to illustrate the "dumbness" of daily situations which myself and I guess other drivers gets into for no good reason and not necessary it is their fault, nowhere I said I have more entitlement to the road.... it is just common sense to give a way to other road users (be that car or otherwise) if you clearly hindering their progress for no reason. That could be applied to the cyclists if that helps you understand the situation better... would you like pedestrian to walk in front of you on cycle path when there are plenty space on the remaining pavement.... no you won't. You would get annoyed and after a while angry... and that is not because you are on bicycle and "have more right" to be on that path, but because pedestrian would simply be unreasonable doing it... common sense can be applied to any situation.

[Shahpor]

I agree with @Rebecca, @doog442 post does not reflect well on him and wasn't warranted.

So, trying to steer the conversation somewhat, Linas, did you ever get the mirror fixed?

[dutchie01]

Here in Holland bicyles are a favourite means of transport and relatively safe as well. Main reason for this is..... bicycle lanes!    

on youtube there is an entertaining 6 minute film called -- how the dutch got their bicycle lanes --

have a look it covers all said in this thread so far.

 

  

[Farqui]

An interesting watch that Bernard.

 

[Linas.P]

5 hours ago, Shahpor said:

So, trying to steer the conversation somewhat, Linas, did you ever get the mirror fixed?

The mirror is not the end of the life, it doesn't dim properly and the middle bit is kind of darker, not an issue during the day... little bit more annoying during the night. In terms of fixing it I guess I won't go with Lexus £700 quote, just going to get glass itself for £50-75, but I will only do it after I hear from police e.g. if the guy pleads guilty or not and if they take him further into the court or not. If they decide to proceed with court it is good idea to keep the mirror as it is.

Cycling lane are only good if cyclists use them, as well Netherlands is not UK and Amsterdam is not a London, different scales, different problems, different distances and different culture. 

[doog442]

On 23/11/2017 at 8:58 PM, Rebecca said:

Shame on you @doog442 😳

Totally unnecessary and uncalled for.

Sorry for upsetting you Rebecca and @shahpor but if you were to read the content of the posts you'd find it was aimed at someone who appears to be totally anti cyclist and impatient with it when it comes to advancing from A to B in his V6 (his words)

I've no issue with his moped / mirror thing, indeed I told him so and best of luck getting it sorted. 

His attack on cyclists as a whole...calling them retarded appears to be acceptable to you and others for some reason. Try riding a bicycle through a city and perhaps look at things from another perspective.   

[doog442]

On 23/11/2017 at 11:43 PM, Linas.P said:

If that is the only point you were able to extract from my post then I guess discussion ends here.

I've extracted numerous points or are you choosing to ignore them.

You state that cyclists are retarded / a menace / a nuisance - all your words. You have stated you want to assault them (punch the C###t down). You have specifically demonstrated your impatience towards cyclists by stating you have a V6 and 204 BHP at your disposal whilst cyclists allegedly upset you by making progress. (Of course its satire now - it wasn't when you originally posted it)

The Highway code give drivers specific responsibilities in relation to cyclists....I suggest you buy one, study it and take the big chip off your shoulder. 

All road users have a responsibility towards each other, cyclists pedestrians and everyone else who uses a road. If you think a cyclist is acting aggressively by hogging a lane and you're getting angry and upset (as you have admitted to ) then the aforementioned Highway code will tell you the lawful reason why they may be doing it. You simply cannot just dismiss cyclists as a public nuisance, rub your hands and walk away .

 

 

[Shahpor]

@doog442 so what is wrong with being anti cyclist? 

I am not against people riding bikes per se, but there have been times when I have had to endure a long tailback on a single country road because of a cyclist, when I wished they were off the road.

Also, as far as Linas wanting to punch them, he was referring to one specific instance, and again, I can relate.

I can't seem to see where he says they are retarded, although I will admit that he does like to type long posts so I may have missed it.

You also state that you think cycling isn't dangerous.  Have you seen what it is like for them on London roads?  If you did, you wouldn't say that.  Since the roads are so narrow, cars, and especially vans/trucks, don't leave much room so it easy for them to get squeezed.  If you watch the episode of Top Gear when Richard Hammond racers the others on a bike, you will see what it's like.  Although you need to watch the outtakes to get a real sense since he swears so much!

Anyway, the point is that while Linas can be grating (there's always one ), he still doesn't deserve what you wrote.  You could always be the bigger man and just leave this be.

 

[doog442]

3 minutes ago, Shahpor said:

Anyway, the point is that while Linas can be grating (there's always one ), he still doesn't deserve what you wrote.  You could always be the bigger man and just leave this be.

 

What did I write that's upset you so much? 

[Shahpor]

Perhaps I misunderstood what you said (it can happen on forums), but you seem to insinuate that, because Linas is not from the UK, that his understanding of the driving laws here are inferior and he comes from a less civilised country.

It came across as quite xenophobic.

[doog442]

9 minutes ago, Shahpor said:

@doog442 so what is wrong with being anti cyclist? 

I am not against people riding bikes per se, but there have been times when I have had to endure a long tailback on a single country road because of a cyclist, when I wished they were off the road.

 

and this is the thing...are you also anti horse riders because they hold you up ? I'm sorry mate but unless we get an attitude change like Holland / Germany / France you will continue to feel totally exasperated  that a cyclist added on a  whole minute or two to  your journey... 

[doog442]

11 minutes ago, Shahpor said:

Perhaps I misunderstood what you said (it can happen on forums), but you seem to insinuate that, because Linas is not from the UK, that his understanding of the driving laws here are inferior and he comes from a less civilised country.

It came across as quite xenophobic.

I had no idea or didnt care where Linas was from until he starting telling me the laws on reflective clothing where he comes from. I've never mentioned it, its never been an issue but he introduced the fact that there are laws in relation to reflective clothing in his country. 

So if his country has laws on reflective clothing for pedestrians (and we dont) why can't I ask if his country has a Highway code.

As I said, it pays to read the thread before jumping to conclusions about xenophobia.

 

 

[Shahpor]

24 minutes ago, doog442 said:

and this is the thing...are you also anti horse riders because they hold you up ? I'm sorry mate but unless we get an attitude change like Holland / Germany / France you will continue to feel totally exasperated  that a cyclist added on a  whole minute or two to  your journey... 

Why do I get the feeling I am being sucked into something here?

Am I anti horse if one is on the road at peak times holding everyone up?  Yes, I am.

And it is not about how much time it added to my journey, but the cumulative affect it has on all concerned. 1 or 2 minutes for me, 1 or 2 minutes for the 50 cars travelling the same road as me, 1 or 2 minutes for the thousands more each day that come across the same thing.

Personally, I don't think an attitude change is necessary; what is necessary are bicycle lanes.

27 minutes ago, doog442 said:

I had no idea or didnt care where Linas was from until he starting telling me the laws on reflective clothing where he comes from. I've never mentioned it, its never been an issue but he introduced the fact that there are laws in relation to reflective clothing in his country. 

So if his country has laws on reflective clothing for pedestrians (and we dont) why can't I ask if his country has a Highway code.

As I said, it pays to read the thread before jumping to conclusions about xenophobia.

 

 

I'm sorry, but this sounds like back pedalling (if you will excuse the pun).  Again, I will say that I could be mistaken, but that it not how your post came across, and it seems I am not the only one who thinks that.

[Linas.P]

Well put @Shahpor 

I am as well in support of cycling lanes, but only if cyclists are forced to use them.. otherwise what is the point? And if we continue sharing same infrastructure, then I am in support of them being trained accordingly and having correct gear which protects them and everyone else. Finally, the law should be enforced regardless of who broken it.

I believe that wasting other people's time is just selfish and unacceptable even if that is 1 minute (as well spotted, if you waste 1 minute on the road you likely have wasted 50 or even 100's of them). Now there is no black and white, but many shades of grey... e.g. when cycling on the road crosses the line between merely making progress and becomes wasting of other people's time?! I consider that example I made in satire was exactly "deliberate wasting" - choosing to slow down 20 cars and hog the lane when there is cycling path, continue hogging the lane when there was 200m long stretch of bus lane/stop etc. As well it doesn't seems that the cyclists jumping red light caught any attention - that is not a problem is it?!

Finally, for any healthy discussion there is a rule "Attack the idea, not the person who holds it"... but it seems that @doog442 goes "Ad hominem" all the way. He just "merely asked" which county I was referring to... what a joke!

 

[doog442]

39 minutes ago, Shahpor said:

I'm sorry, but this sounds like back pedalling (if you will excuse the pun).  Again, I will say that I could be mistaken, but that it not how your post came across, and it seems I am not the only one who thinks that.

Don't apologise. You made the accusation and you want something to fit your agenda whatever that is. Am I sensing some kind of political correctness when you are happy to to ignore what others might deem to be offensive..ie the term retarded or does that get lost in translation when its suits your argument.

 

[Shahpor]

Agenda?  A tad paranoid perhaps?  Maybe you don't see an agenda because there isn't one?

Also, what I said wasn't an accusation, it was an opinion.

As for political correctness, did you even read my post?

1 hour ago, Shahpor said:

I can't seem to see where he says they are retarded, although I will admit that he does like to type long posts so I may have missed it.

So, please show me where he said that, and I will agree with you that he shouldn't have said it.

[rich1068]

Give it up @doog442

You're never going to get much support for cyclists on a car forum. The vocal "they're a menace" lot will always win out. These sort of discussions are best avoided. I've dipped into this once or twice since my original posts, shaken my head and left again. I see stupid cyclists most days but I see a lot more stupid car, van and lorry drivers and the consequences of their acts of ignorance and stupidity are usually a damn sight more serious.

Go and talk about winter tyres or something. Or politics. Much safer.

[dutchie01]

Now thats an idea Richard as most politicians want to make winter tyres mandatory as it is safer!

 

[peachy]

Have a day off @doog442 FFS 

Surely you have better things to be doing with your time.

[Guest]

Agree about cyclists....

Sent from my STV100-4 using Tapatalk

[doog442]

1 hour ago, peachy said:

Have a day off @doog442 FFS 

Surely you have better things to be doing with your time.

Here to spread the cycling love my friend 

 

 

 

 

[Spacewagon52]

Excellent! That is just what we need here, a bit of humour!

[Linas.P]

Final status:

Police identified and arrested suspect, however during interview suspect pleaded not guilty. Police decided that due to lack of evidence (video from dash cam doesn't count) they will not pursue criminal damage case in the court. The end.

I cannot argue much, because one would need some good imagination to judge from the dash cam video. What can be seen is that moped rider swings his hand and "I claim" then hits my mirror - it can be heard, but it isn't visible. The pictures after accident adds more value as the marks on the mirror matches the motion of the swing and it can be "assumed" my version of the story is correct.

The problem is that in Magistrates court one could simply say "I have hit the mirror, but I have not damaged it" and this is apparently good enough explanation, then the justice requires CPS to prove otherwise, which is obviously not possible, because the contact between the hand and mirror is not on the tape... even if it would be on the tape it woudl be hard to prove mirror was actually damaged.

To summarise:

It is ok to hit and kick other people property as long as no damage is made (or can be proven). I am really annoyed about this approach of British police and I considering that mere fact of hitting something (even if no damage is caused) is a crime. However, I do appreciate they have arrested the person and interviewed him - I guess that is probably enough for him to "think" next time before attempting anything similar.

[NemesisUK]

31 minutes ago, Linas.P said:

(video from dash cam doesn't count

"Can dash cam footage be used in court? Absolutely. Dash cams can provide invaluable information in a case that would otherwise have been left to testimony and conjecture. In 2015 the UK courts saw its first jail sentence handed out off the back of incriminating dash cam footage. The dangerous driver wasn't caught red-handed by police, but instead was only arrested after police were shown dash cam footage from a concerned citizen."

Read more: https://www.which.co.uk/reviews/dash-cams/article/dash-cams-and-the-law-what-you-need-to-know - Which?

[Texas]

"" 

3 hours ago, Linas.P said:

I guess that is probably enough for him to "think" next time before attempting anything similar.

Do you really think so?

Do you think this was the very fist time he has ever done this sort of action??

just saying but he 'got away' with it this time so why not in the future?

I'd like to get medieval with a pair of pliers to try and instill some respect!!!!!

paul m.