Unleaded Fuel which one and is expensive worth it!!

[200h]

colin the last time i looked at costco petrol prices it was about 8p / ltr cheaper

[Mikeyb999]

35 minutes ago, 200h said:

colin the last time i looked at costco petrol prices it was about 8p / ltr cheaper

I Paid 1.109 there on Friday for UL - think the diesel was the same price

[sorcerer]

33 minutes ago, Mikeyb999 said:

I Paid 1.109 there on Friday for UL - think the diesel was the same price

Same price as Asda here, 110.9ppl

[Scoops1964]

Asda or Morrisons.  Local and cheap.

[Wass]

On 8/13/2017 at 9:05 PM, doog442 said:

How refreshing that unlike some other forums (BMW) you dont get shot down in flames and told to use the search function as the question has been asked a million times before.

Well done LOC

I've mixed and matched over the years and never noticed a difference (other than in my wallet) so just go with regular. 

 

 

I own a BMW motorcycle and their forum tend to be a cut above too. 

[Bowserman]

On 13/08/2017 at 2:05 PM, Wass said:

Lexus have published their minimum recommended octane rating for the CT. It is 87 for all CT models. Using higher octane than 87 means that the ECU has to compensate less for pre-ignition and the engine can run with more ignition advance or possibly a weaker fuel air mixture. Like most computers, it just depends how it happens to be programmed. How it happens to be programmed varies from manufacturer to manufacturer and sometime from model to model of the same car. We already know that the CT ECU can run a number of different options, some of which are driver selected in a very dumbed down manner.

 Supermarket fuel v named brand fuel. All made to the same EU standard and all can come from the same storage tank at the depot. Why do some people say that expensive fuel is better than cheap fuel? The answers to this vary throughout the spectrum from self assurance  to the way their local supermarket looks after its tanks.

You are right in saying that the fuel comes from the same tanks at the terminal, however, different companies use less quantities of additive which is injected into the line as we fill the tanker. The supermarkets use less additive.

 

[First_Lexus]

I ran my previous Honda CRV (I- VTEC petrol) only on BP Ultimate for over a year, then switched to only Tesco standard unleaded for a few months, and posted the results on a Honda forum where a similar debate was raging.

BP Ultimate gave an increased economy of 2-4mpg over the period, and my perception was that the engine performed better with it, although I accept this is both subjective and liable to the placebo effect.

As others have said, this is mostly about preference and belief. Some consumers buy Tesco Value baked beans, others have to buy HP or Heinz. Both effectively do the same job at different price points. Are they really much different? It's all about choice and preference.

[rayaans]

6 minutes ago, First_Lexus said:

I ran my previous Honda CRV (I- VTEC petrol) only on BP Ultimate for over a year, then switched to only Tesco standard unleaded for a few months, and posted the results on a Honda forum where a similar debate was raging.

BP Ultimate gave an increased economy of 2-4mpg over the period, and my perception was that the engine performed better with it, although I accept this is both subjective and liable to the placebo effect.

As others have said, this is mostly about preference and belief. Some consumers buy Tesco Value baked beans, others have to buy HP or Heinz. Both effectively do the same job at different price points. Are they really much different? It's all about choice and preference.

Maybe there is a difference between BP Ultimate and Tesco petrol but I haven't noticed any difference between BP Ultimate and BP standard in my own cars. Having said that, it made a difference in my sons VW Golf which runs a lot smoother - eerily so on 97 ron+ fuels

[SonnyA85]

On 13/08/2017 at 2:05 PM, Wass said:

Lexus have published their minimum recommended octane rating for the CT. It is 87 for all CT models. Using higher octane than 87 means that the ECU has to compensate less for pre-ignition and the engine can run with more ignition advance or possibly a weaker fuel air mixture. Like most computers, it just depends how it happens to be programmed. How it happens to be programmed varies from manufacturer to manufacturer and sometime from model to model of the same car. We already know that the CT ECU can run a number of different options, some of which are driver selected in a very dumbed down manner.

 Supermarket fuel v named brand fuel. All made to the same EU standard and all can come from the same storage tank at the depot. Why do some people say that expensive fuel is better than cheap fuel? The answers to this vary throughout the spectrum from self assurance  to the way their local supermarket looks after its tanks.

They may well come from the same depot. However the premium fuels have more cleaning additives and better mixtures. The likes of shell have spent millions on research in this department as it's in their best interests to do so.

 

For example tesco have revealed their momentum fuel has 5 times the cleaning additives their normal fuel does. So it's not all about octane or coming from the same depot. The additives are completely different in both quality and quantity.

On 13/08/2017 at 2:43 PM, Britprius said:

I must disagree with you there Peter on two counts possibly three.

One your going to get less mpg from V Power in spite of what the adds say.

Two your paying "in your words" possibly £5 extra for less mpg.

A fuel additive "injector cleaner" added twice a year would have the same or better results at less cost.

I did work for Esso Petroleum for a number of years, and most of what you hear is marketing hype.

Although the CT "the car the OP is asking about" has a high theoretical compression ratio, it's actual compression ratio is much lower as being an Atkinson cycle engine the inlet valves are kept open for part of the compression "short compression" stroke so reducing it's compression. It also has a long stroke combustion designed for a long slow burn to get the most from the mixture expansion as it burns. This increases the engine efficiency.

John.

Funny how I have always consistently got higher MPG from premium fuels. In any car I have had. BMW, Mini, VW. Only had the Lexus 1 day and it's first stop was to fill it with V Power. Just to help keep it clean inside.

 

fuel additive injector cleaners only work on certain cars. mainly older ones. they will  never make up for years of crap building up inside the engine. they are built by small companies. you really think redex knows more about cleaning inside engines than a billion dollar company like shell who are paying the top chemists £200K a year to do research on the matter for them and have spent millions every year on it.

You only have to look at formula 1 as an example or any other car sport. They use premium fuels designed by the likes of Shell. You won't see a rally driver chucking in some cheap injector cleaner into his £200k rally car to help keep it clean.

On 13/08/2017 at 4:33 PM, sorcerer said:

Whenever I see topics like this it always makes me smile because it's an argument that just keeps on going - people will believe what they want to believe.

Personally, I think it's all hype. As Wass says above, it's all made to the same EU standard and the one tanker filling up from the one storage tank can deliver to both supermarkets and high-street forecourts on the same day.

MPG is too fickle to make a difference and cannot be proved to be down to the petrol except under laboratory conditions. In the real world it can be affected by many things, even wind speed and direction on any given day, yet some people will swear that it's due to the super-dooper expensive stuff they put in.

If clean engines are your thing (not just the OP but anyone), run on LPG like I do, which is by far the cleanest fuel. 9,000 miles between oil changes and the oil comes out almost as clean as it goes in with no lack of performance - better for the environment, better for the engine and better on the wallet.

One tanker filling up can deliver to both supermarkets and "high-street forecourts" I don't think so. Please stop spouting rubbish. Every time I have seen a tanker at ASDA the tanker says ASDA on the side of it. I have never seen this ASDA tanker roll up to Shell and unload it's cargo into their tanks.

On 13/08/2017 at 5:03 PM, Rebecca said:

I used shell v power religiously for the first few months after purchasing my lexus. I then switched to esso 95 ron and noticed no loss of performance whatsoever. Strange thing is I get slightly more mpg with the regular. 

I stick to regular now but do run the odd tank of v power every now and again to keep the system clean. 

You won't notice any loss of performance as the car was never designed to take advantage of it. It's not a sports car or a super car or a big huge engine with loads of bhp.

Also more mpg with regular can be down to change in many different variables I have always found the opposite to be true.

On 13/08/2017 at 10:47 PM, Fatts said:

For the last twelve years I have used mostly Asda or Tesco fuels with no problems at all. 

Dont know what you guys are talking about.

There is no problem with the fuel. However it doesn't clean as well as premium BP or Shell fuels. My thoughts on the matter are this. If you own a sports car or a car capable of taking advantage of V Power, Momentum or Ultimate it should use it exclusively.

If you own a premium car which you paid a premium for and are going to be keeping it for a great length of time. Spending the extra £5 per tank will reap you rewards long term. You will find as the system is kept cleaner it returns the same MPG consistently. It won't decrease in power over time either. The internals will be sparkly clean. You also get better mpg too if the car has a knock sensor. There are no downsides as the MPG increase and cleaning is well worth the additional £5. Basically don't use it on a £200 mondeo however if you have dropped £30K+ on a Lexus then the last thing you should be worried about is saving £5 every 2 weeks. Unless of course it's a lease deal and you plan on handing it back after 2-4 years as you never actually own the car so you don't care if it lasts longer than your rental agreement.

If you plan on keeping the car for a long time use premium products. I won't chuck any old engine oil into the engine. I use exclusively Petronas's top of the range line and Castrol GTX titanium or whatever their top end is at the time. I have a 15 year old sports car. Recently had the engine taken apart to rebuild it's timing unit with better components than those fitted at factory. The mechanic noted it was one of the cleanest he had seen and asked me about mileage and was shocked when I told him. He said he had seen the same car with 1/3rd of the mileage and it was a horror show inside needed £2K worth of work getting it back to normal again.

I talk to proper specialists all the time. I regularly travel 400-600 miles round trips from Glasgow to Liverpool and Newcastle where the best specialists for my sports car are for jobs to be done properly and I listen to their advice on maintenance and care. All of them promote premium products. Check out Petronas's range of engine oils they are doing some great things and the quality is top notch.

[iwonder]

You lost me at fuel injector cleaners are built by small companies. 

Seems like you took lots of different opinions and mixed them all together. 

Fuel cleaners work

[colin79666]

Well Costco round these parts has been selling fuel since last month. Been through a few tankfuls now. My wallet is certainly happier with 108.9 vs the additional 7-15p per litre that BP/Shell are asking. 4p a litre cheaper than Asda. Costco make quite a bit play about the fact they put the full suite of additives in both the 99 Ron and standard 95 Ron fuels. 

[SonnyA85]

5 hours ago, colin79666 said:

Well Costco round these parts has been selling fuel since last month. Been through a few tankfuls now. My wallet is certainly happier with 108.9 vs the additional 7-15p per litre that BP/Shell are asking. 4p a litre cheaper than Asda. Costco make quite a bit play about the fact they put the full suite of additives in both the 99 Ron and standard 95 Ron fuels. 

I find that hard to believe especially with their fuel being so cheap. Cheaper than asda yet has all the additives? Shell and BP's additive mixture is a secret. Costco don't know what they are putting in it. So if they do have additives they aren't the same ones. Likely much cheaper ones that don't clean anywhere near as well.

 

There is nothing wrong with their fuel. If I had an old banger I would use it gladly. Premium fuel is for decent cars you intend on keeping for a long time or can take advantage of it as I have stated before. I'd rather spend the extra 15p per litre. It's £8 a tank compared to Costco and £5 a tank compared to ASDA. Which to me is £125 a year difference (6-8K mileage). I'd rather spend the extra £100 a year to keep my £8-10K engine clean.

 

It's literally nothing £100 a year saving. If I was that strapped for cash I wouldn't be driving a Lexus.

[rayaans]

I generally use BP exclusively - simply because Tesco/Asda around here are maybe 5p/l cheaper so I don't think its worth it skimping out on fuel. I also only drive 10k/ year, my wife about 3-4k per year so not going to make a massive difference.

Also appears that there's 3 BPs within 2 miles of me and its about £1.19 at the moment.

[Bowserman]

On 19/11/2017 at 11:47 AM, SonnyA85 said:

One tanker filling up can deliver to both supermarkets and "high-street forecourts" I don't think so. Please stop spouting rubbish. Every time I have seen a tanker at ASDA the tanker says ASDA on the side of it. I have never seen this ASDA tanker roll up to Shell and unload it's cargo into their tanks.

Wrong. Maybe the Asda trailer is on a dedicated contract, but will still fill up at the likes of Navigator Terminals which supplies most of the branded fuels. A lot of companies includint he one I work for now have a white fleet, that deliver to various forecourts. To be fair, Shell V Power does have its own dedicated arm at the terminal, the rest just have varying amounts of additive injected in to their own recipes as we load. The base fuel is all the same.

[Bowserman]

On 19/11/2017 at 8:06 PM, SonnyA85 said:

I find that hard to believe especially with their fuel being so cheap. Cheaper than asda yet has all the additives? Shell and BP's additive mixture is a secret. Costco don't know what they are putting in it. So if they do have additives they aren't the same ones. Likely much cheaper ones that don't clean anywhere near as well.

 

There is nothing wrong with their fuel. If I had an old banger I would use it gladly. Premium fuel is for decent cars you intend on keeping for a long time or can take advantage of it as I have stated before. I'd rather spend the extra 15p per litre. It's £8 a tank compared to Costco and £5 a tank compared to ASDA. Which to me is £125 a year difference (6-8K mileage). I'd rather spend the extra £100 a year to keep my £8-10K engine clean.

 

It's literally nothing £100 a year saving. If I was that strapped for cash I wouldn't be driving a Lexus.

Again, wrong.

Costco are supplied from Navigator (Greenergy) and they add there own additives at the forecourt. The premium diesel is as good as anyone else's, and thats the only diesel they supply. Premium unleaded is the same. I use Costco normal unleaded in my 400h which is more than enough.

[joelfigueira]

Hi all,

so now we have E10 fuel coming to our forecourts in September will we see more people turn to the premium fuel as from what I have read about E10 we could lose out on MPG because there is more ethanol. (I could be wrong) 

[Las Palmas]

1 hour ago, joelfigueira said:

Hi all,

so now we have E10 fuel coming to our forecourts in September will we see more people turn to the premium fuel as from what I have read about E10 we could lose out on MPG because there is more ethanol. (I could be wrong) 

We can all be wrong now and then.

[scudney]

I will just continue to use the higher octane fuel(Momentum 99,V power etc)which I have done for the last 17 plus years 😀 

[NemesisUK]

2 minutes ago, scudney said:

I will just continue to use the higher octane fuel(Momentum 99,V power etc)which I have done for the last 17 plus years 😀 

Ditto 👍

[Las Palmas]

Difference in price is so little that if you do not drive 50km daily it will be hard to notice (where we live).

Shell gasoline smells worse than the rest so it must be best. Here is called super something v-power or something else and no mentioning of octane content.

[joelfigueira]

On 8/13/2017 at 2:43 PM, Britprius said:

I must disagree with you there Peter on two counts possibly three.

One your going to get less mpg from V Power in spite of what the adds say.

Two your paying "in your words" possibly £5 extra for less mpg.

A fuel additive "injector cleaner" added twice a year would have the same or better results at less cost.

I did work for Esso Petroleum for a number of years, and most of what you hear is marketing hype.

Although the CT "the car the OP is asking about" has a high theoretical compression ratio, it's actual compression ratio is much lower as being an Atkinson cycle engine the inlet valves are kept open for part of the compression "short compression" stroke so reducing it's compression. It also has a long stroke combustion designed for a long slow burn to get the most from the mixture expansion as it burns. This increases the engine efficiency.

John.

Hi John,

what fuel additive would you recommend? 

[Phil xxkr]

On 11/19/2017 at 8:06 PM, SonnyA85 said:

I find that hard to believe especially with their fuel being so cheap. Cheaper than asda yet has all the additives? Shell and BP's additive mixture is a secret. Costco don't know what they are putting in it. So if they do have additives they aren't the same ones. Likely much cheaper ones that don't clean anywhere near as well.

 

There is nothing wrong with their fuel. If I had an old banger I would use it gladly. Premium fuel is for decent cars you intend on keeping for a long time or can take advantage of it as I have stated before. I'd rather spend the extra 15p per litre. It's £8 a tank compared to Costco and £5 a tank compared to ASDA. Which to me is £125 a year difference (6-8K mileage). I'd rather spend the extra £100 a year to keep my £8-10K engine clean.

 

It's literally nothing £100 a year saving. If I was that strapped for cash I wouldn't be driving a Lexus.

Coming from Scotland Sonny I find anyone saying £100, AFTER TAX, is literally nothing amazing? I don't think even the people from Noble Grossart would agree 😱 I don't work for Costco btw but they have such a huge buying power, consider this, their turnover is greater than Shell, so it's no surprise that they can negotiate much lower prices with no sacrifice in quality not only in fuel but across the board, you should try it sometime. 

[dublet]

10 minutes ago, Phil xxkr said:

I don't work for Costco btw but they have such a huge buying power, consider this, their turnover is greater than Shell, so it's no surprise that they can negotiate much lower prices with no sacrifice in quality not only in fuel but across the board, you should try it sometime. 

Turnover in 2020: Costco 160 billion USD, Royal Shell 180 billion USD. So close, but no cigar. Also, Shell would actually be drilling for oil, running refineries and distributing it. Whereas Costco sells lots of things aside from fuel.

[Phil xxkr]

1 hour ago, dublet said:

Turnover in 2020: Costco 160 billion USD, Royal Shell 180 billion USD. So close, but no cigar. Also, Shell would actually be drilling for oil, running refineries and distributing it. Whereas Costco sells lots of things aside from fuel.

Since you like Americanisms Pilgrim, get with the programme! My figures are based on 2021 numbers which by and large show Shells  huge losses are broadly equivalent to Costco huge profits. Now before I get off my horse and drink my milk as a negotiator who do you think has the best hand? 💪

[dublet]

32 minutes ago, Phil xxkr said:

My figures are based on 2021 numbers which by and large show Shells  huge losses are broadly equivalent to Costco huge profits. Now before I get off my horse and drink my milk as a negotiator who do you think has the best hand? 💪

2021 isn't finished according to my calendar here on Earth. Perhaps not the same on your planet. Furthermore, you just switched from turnover/revenue to P&L, for some reason, which are not the same. While this is false equivalence and therefore merely an informal fallacy, it certainly does sour your milk and serves to render your argument invalid.

With this sort of expert negotiation on display you'd best be on guard, lest you suddenly find yourself appointed a UK trade envoy.