A Service Engineers Opinion!

purse3223 · March 24, 2017

I have recently had fitted a Blackvue dashcam in my IS300h. My prime reason for this is to ensure that I have some protection should anything happen in front of me but it also highlighted some interesting views of a Lexus Bristol engineer today when it went in for an intermediate service today.

First to put some context to this story. A couple of miles into the journey to the showroom I noticed the paddles would not work as normal and it would not go from drive into S mode. A short distance later I had the warning flash up 'Hybrid System Has Stopped. Please Stop Your Car in a Safe Place'

I did this and turned the engine off. It restarted OK then I carried on my journey. Now, something to point out here is that I was low on fuel. The display indicated I had about 30 miles left. I have been as low as 7 miles and haven't seen this behaviour before. I realise I should probably not let it get too low on fuel and most of the time I don't.

Anyway back to the point of the post. I informed the service dept of this occurrence on arrival which was duly noted down on the paperwork for checking.

I have reviewed the camera footage recorded during its service and at one point my engineer summons another to discuss the notes written on the paperwork about the warning message that flashed up earlier. He points out that there is an engine management code - Fuel Run Out - but no hybrid system code. When he hears about the paddles not working he find it highly amusing - "thats **** ridiculous because they don't do nothing. That's just **** about with the ECU. It doesn't make the car go any different, it's a computer game. All this (obviously pointing out the paddles to his mate........) doesn't do anything. It's a total illusion, it tells the machine 'oh he wants to **** play or make it sound like he's changing gear'. It doesn't do **** all."

I am fully aware that the paddles do not change gear and that they are purely frequency steps in a CVT unit. I use it akin to some engine braking to avoid unnecessary periods of dabbing the brake pedal. My point was that they were not working AT ALL.

Anyway back to our engineer (whose first name is mentioned but I won't reveal it here). He goes on to say, "the trouble is these ***** think its electric.... (at which point my engineer quickly indicates the existence of the dashcam!) ....the trouble is they think it's electric and fuel and if they run out of fuel they can carry on with electric, they can't, they work in conjunction with each other"

The other says, "so it needs fuel basically" followed by a chuckle.

Again I am fully aware of the basic workings of the hybrid system. I do not expect the engine to keep working without any petrol in it. I am happy to accept that the indicated code probably had something to do with the issue but I did not totally run out of fuel. After I had restarted the engine I travelled a few more miles to get to the showroom.

I repeat I did not install the dashcam to nosey in on engineers who service my car but I guess I was curious. Anyway my curiosity has discovered that one particular engineer at Bristol thinks this particular Lexus owner is as thick as ****!

Now do I mention it when Lexus ask me for feedback on my service experience? I'm pretty thick skinned but to be called a ****** and basically clueless has ****** me off a little!

Having posted this Ive just noticed the foul language is edited out. Rightly so probably but suffice to say one of the foul words he likened me to was the worst. You know the one I mean.

Verbout · March 24, 2017

Put it on YouTube, not for the public to see, give Lexus the private link to view and wait for the result.

Big Rat · March 24, 2017

@purse3223

Tim

All very unfortunate we've had discussion/ poll running on the isF forum for a while, purely for members to give their opinion and experiences.

I am a great believer in self protectionism, as a vehicle of the marque we drive is probably the second most valuable item we own now I know the camera was not put there by you to catch anyone out but what it demonstrates all to frequently is the behaviour of those we entrust the vehicle to, Lexus Bristol is part of the Sytner Group as is the Mercedes dealership at Cribbs Causeway, where there was a well published incident of a vehicle on test being driven in a very questionable manner as to speed limits and so on all on camera.

I come from a mainly BMW back ground and had a vehicle of mine on test by a main dealer I will not name who drove my M3 in excess of 120mph in a 30 mph limit initially it was me that received the NIP for this before the matter was resolved.

I think you should go back to them and request a meeting with the dealer principal and go from there.

Big Rat

rayaans · March 24, 2017

Wouldn't worry about foul language. Used all the time in any workplace, including where I work (NHS)

The only reason you know what he's said is because of the dashcam

At the end of the day, does it really matter what he says? I think it'd be pretty petty to hand that over and get a guy sacked for being a normal bloke.

Remember that he probably doesn't know the full situation as engineers don't talk to customers. It's the service manager that probably wrote down that paddles don't work or something causing the engineer to reply as he did

Now if there was something malicious going on, if he damaged the car or something that's different.

As far as I'm concerned, if he checked what needed to be checked, that's his job done.

Big Rat · March 24, 2017

19 minutes ago, rayaans said:

Wouldn't worry about foul language. Used all the time in any workplace, including where I work (NHS)

The only reason you know what he's said is because of the dashcam

At the end of the day, does it really matter what he says? I think it'd be pretty petty to hand that over and get a guy sacked for being a normal bloke.

Remember that he probably doesn't know the full situation as engineers don't talk to customers. It's the service manager that probably wrote down that paddles don't work or something causing the engineer to reply as he did

Now if there was something malicious going on, if he damaged the car or something that's different.

As far as I'm concerned, if he checked what needed to be checked, that's his job done.

@rayaans Yes in retrospect perhaps I'm am being a little harsh, and when it comes to language being a builder site work has its fair share shall we say.

And I suppose my views are somewhat coloured by personal experiences over many years the speeding one I cited is just one of many and I feel at times that we pay a not inconsiderable amount of money for 'service' of vehicles and are entitled to some consistency of quality of that service.

I don't know maybe it's just a sign of the times and I sound a bit like an old fuddy duddy ''tis a shame though.

Bug Rat

purse3223 · March 24, 2017

1 minute ago, Big Rat said:

@rayaans Yes in retrospect perhaps I'm am being a little harsh, and when it comes to language being a builder site work has its fair share shall we say.

And I suppose my views are somewhat coloured by personal experiences over many years the speeding one I cited is just one of many and I feel at times that we pay a not inconsiderable amount of money for 'service' of vehicles and are entitled to some consistency of quality of that service.

I don't know maybe it's just a sign of the times and I sound a bit like an old fuddy duddy ''tis a shame though.

Bug Rat

Thanks for the replies guys.

Like I said, I'm pretty thick skinned having served 33 years as a police officer. I know I'd have been none the wiser if the camera had not been there but I guess my integrity as a customer was being called into question.

Perhaps I'll leave it at telling Lexus to make there engineers aware of the possible existence of customers dashcams! Which I'm sure they probably have - or should have!

Cheers.

Geoffers · March 24, 2017

So did they do anything other than attempt to read the diagnostic code?

Irrelevant whether it was intended to be hear or not.

Yes it should be brought to someones attention because the engineer clearly doesn't give a toss of the features and what anyone what think about them. He's paid to do it.

Basically he's just said you're an idiot for even bringing it up. I wouldn't publish it publicly, I'm with Verbout. He won't get the sack at all we all know that.

He should be taking pride in what he does. Even if it's a job he hates, there's no need to belittle the customer.

capese21 · March 25, 2017

I took my GS to have four new tyres fitted by a local garage bought from a well known online supplier. My dash cam recorded the fitter going for a test drive, swearing at other drivers & to cap it all he broke wind on my seat.

I asked him why he needed a test drive and he said "to make sure the balancing was correct" imho he wanted a turn in a nice car. He had no idea the dash cam was there.

No harm was done and after a good clean of the seat (& steering wheel) I saw the funny side. I doubt I would go to this "premiere fitting centre" again though as it was just to rough & ready. I dread to think what a standard place was like if this one was classed as premiere!!

Mechanics always swear but as long as they do a good job I don't care even if they do fart on my seat.

Ed

marrat · March 25, 2017

Seems like normal behaviour to me really. Most professionals usually assume the guy on the other side is a moron. The paddles are probably some inside joke between Lexus mechanics since they are there just for show.

capese21 · March 25, 2017

5 minutes ago, marrat said:

The paddles are probably some inside joke between Lexus mechanics since they are there just for show.

They work well enough on my GS not that I have any desire to use them.

tanimbar · March 25, 2017

The paddles do work as Lexus intended and I don't understand why people, especially mechanics, think otherwise.

I use a down-shift (or 2) when descending long, steep hills.

I select a lower 'gear' if I'm preparing to overtake; the transmission drops a 'gear' (not really on a CVT but you know what I mean) and the engine revs rise in preparation for the overtake.

That mechanic is simply displaying his ignorance. The fact that he works at Bristol, one of my local Lexus dealers, gives me cause for concern.

Rabbers · March 25, 2017

7 hours ago, capese21 said:

....I don't care even if they do fart on my seat.

Edwardo, are you serious? I would have demanded that the car interior be immediately sanitised, preferably with ozone, after asking the farter

or his employers to produce medical testimony that he was not suffering from any intestinal disease more serious than simple flatulence....

floggit · March 25, 2017

On a separate but related theme, my previous car was cam equipped and i reviewed the recorded material again not to catch anyone out but just out of interest. The guy swore like a trooper, fine. Slagged off my rear aftermarket tinted windows, fine i had kids in car and shaded them in summer. Saw car go to wash n vac area after service and although fine i will request not to be valeted in future as these guys work to a timescale not a quality scale but within reason fine. It was only then i realised part of the service was a roadtest, guess what? The car never left the site. I brought thus to attention of the service manager who first said the roadtest was not part of the service then as i showed him the ticked box on service sheet for roadtest he then went on to say the mechanic used the wrong service sheet. At this point id lost confidence in what should have happened and what did. Vw uk website shows a roadtest as part of the service so i was lied to. I now have the lexus and expect i better level of service. September will tell.

capese21 · March 25, 2017

1 minute ago, Rabbers said:

Edwardo, are you serious?

Yes perfectly serious, I would not have know without the dash cam. Everybody passes wind and he had trousers on & a boiler suit not a bare behind!!

I have no doubt the previous owner did similar. I know I have many times.

The fitter & the general feel of the "premiere fitting centre" was one of not a place I would want to cross. How the online retailer could trust them with their brand was surprising. Probably why the tyres were so well priced, something had to give.

Ed

paulrnx · March 25, 2017

I'd go into the dealership and ask to speak to the technicians. I'd sit them down in a quiet corner of the dealership and show them my video. Afterwards I'd ask them what they thought. Then I'd make it clear that I knew what a Lexus hybrid was and I loved the car and they were lucky I wasn't planning to put the video on YouTube and naming and shaming the dealership. I wouldn't take it any further than that

doog442 · March 26, 2017

Referring to your customer base as the C word doesn't sit easy with me in the slightest.

It demonstrates a lack of professionalism in front of colleagues plus a general sense of negativity and lack of respect.

He needs some suitable advice.

purse3223 · March 26, 2017

4 minutes ago, doog442 said:

Referring to your customer base as the C word doesn't sit easy with me in the slightest.

It demonstrates a lack of professionalism in front of colleagues plus a general sense of negativity and lack of respect.

He needs some suitable advice.

Thanks for your thoughts doog442!

I'm still considering my response. I don't want to be seen as a moaner but it is the use of that word that I don't particularly like. Like I said above I am thick skinned and I'm not looking to cause trouble. I'm expecting the normal courtesy call from Lisa, the Lexus Bristol receptionist, tomorrow. Could be interesting explaining the events to her!

capese21 · March 26, 2017

My wife took her car into the dealer for servicing and they had disconnected the dash cam.

Mechanics & builders have always used colourful language imho. Not sure they actually hate the customer though.

Unless they say it to to my face then I am not overly bothered.

Ed

Rabbers · March 27, 2017

The use of a dashcam for surveillance of people working on your car is liable to make you even more cynical than you probably

already are about living in an age in which fewer and fewer purveyors of goods and services, especially specialised ones, believe

that "the customer is always right", let alone that you are not a moron. In the worst hypothesis you may even discover your

trusty mechanic to be the counterpart of cooks who pee in the soup or waiters who spit in your plate, in which case you may

prefer not to have known.

My admiration for Lexus is so great that I am sometimes embarrassed by it, but I can largely justify it by having found no serious

grounds for complaint at the six Lexus dealerships in three different countries I have had occasion to use at one time or another

over the years, looking at their workshops and talking to the mechanics and supervisors. More to the point, it has never even

remotely crossed my mind that any of the latter might behave unprofessionally, unconscientiously or discourteously when out of

a customer's sight. Instinct and experience therefore predispose me towards giving them the benefit of the doubt with less

reluctance than I customarily feel towards most other purveyors of essential technical services. Which is just as well since any

objective need to switch Lexus dealerships would for me and many other owners lead to inconveniently longer journeys for

servicing and a probable shift in loyalty with the next change of car.

rayaans · March 27, 2017

22 hours ago, purse3223 said:

Thanks for your thoughts doog442!

I'm still considering my response. I don't want to be seen as a moaner but it is the use of that word that I don't particularly like. Like I said above I am thick skinned and I'm not looking to cause trouble. I'm expecting the normal courtesy call from Lisa, the Lexus Bristol receptionist, tomorrow. Could be interesting explaining the events to her!

Getting too old I think. Becomes problematic when you start thinking into it too much.

Seems to be a buzz word among the youngsters at the moment and I wouldn't worry about it. Its just another swear word.

Remember that the service guy works on the car around the back in the service bay. He doesn't work in the showroom and he doesn't talk to customers, therefore, the language he uses is irrelevant. It'd be a different matter if he was a salesman.

Id say give the guy a break and let it go - the only reason you know what he said is because you were essentially spying on him!

Martin F · March 27, 2017

On 26 March 2017 at 8:44 PM, capese21 said:

Unless they say it to to my face then I am not overly bothered.

Ed

And here in is one of the problems in today's society.

Why say it at all unless you would say it to somebody's face?

capese21 · March 27, 2017

38 minutes ago, Martin F said:

And here in is one of the problems in today's society.

Why say it at all unless you would say it to somebody's face?

There is a difference in overhearing a conversation or bit of banter than them looking you in the eye & saying the same. Lighten up there are more important things to stress over imho.