Cheap LS460, the fun starts...

[Haylands]

 

[Haylands]

I do love the Blackpool illuminations at night... just right.... Not a brilliant picture but the best my Iphone can do...!!!! 

[ScousePaul]

"Warp speed Mr. Sulu"

 

[messi]

39 minutes ago, Haylands said:

I do love the Blackpool illuminations at night... just right.... Not a brilliant picture but the best my iPhone can do...!!!! 

Omg thats really nice

[Tulpen]

Some of the display messages are pretty good also. A couple of weeks ago I got a message 'Air Conditioning Filter Requires Changing'. I checked the filter, which I knew had been changed in Nov 2015, (it is in the glove box - same as the 400) and the problem was leaves. I blew the filter through, gently, with compressed air and refitted it. The message had gone.

This is what the inside of mine looks like (I live in Holland).

[Haylands]

That's weird, I had the same message, says in the manual that it is set by the dealers when they change it and the warning is based on time... It say to press the climate off button for 4 secs to clear it, which I did and it went... maybe it has a sensor as well, then and it knew that flow was restricted...

Dam clever cars...

 

[Tulpen]

Yes, and because they are so clever, it is logical that there must be a sensor as well. Just giving a calendar based message doesn't make that much sense.

There is a 'gotcha' when you change the filter. When you remove the inside of the glovebox, you may see a plastic flap blocking access to the filter. This is the airflow diverter for the air recirculation feature. Pressing the recirc button (with the ignition 'ON') motors it out of the way. On the US forum, there are stories of people using force and breaking the flap. Not everyone is fortunate enough to have the workshop manual :)

There are quite a few differences between LHD/RHD versions and, in small markets, like Holland, the equipment levels are fixed. Here, a sunroof is standard and Lane Keeping Assist is only available on the 600 - at least on the 2007 model.

Systems reset on mine consists of pressing the 'INFO' and airco 'AUTO' buttons at the same time for a few seconds until a double beep is heard.

What is the small module on the top of your steering column........is that to do with the distance sensors?

Mine has only done 70,000 miles so I have no ball joint problems. My local Lexus dealer tells me that they have changed a few but not until cars have done around 180,000 miles. I'm aware that, on the US forum, there are instances of ball joint failure at, only, 40 - 50,000 miles. Of course, the state of the roads has a huge effect.

Some cars have wind noise from the front doors; there is a fix for this........

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-4th-gen-2007-present/506217-instructions-for-the-jmcraney-wind-noise-fix.html

I didn't need to do it on mine but, apparently, it works very well.

I've had my 460 for almost 5 years and never get tired of driving it :)

 

[Haylands]

I think you mean this box

Mine hasn't got one, I think it's something to do with the lane assist...

Some great tips there..

Workshop manual is available on line with a $26.95 yearly subscription here http://www.alldatadiy.com/ well worth it if you do some work yourself...

Looking at the state of the tyres on mine, all four have numerous chunks out the sidewall, I imagine my front suspension problems are caused by repeatedly bumping up curbs....

New tyres will be fitted after suspension and before 4 wheel alignment..

Thanks for the link re wind noise, the passenger side on mine is not too quiet...

[Haylands]

I've just ordered a set of these..

Was going to go with a genuine set but the Ivory ones come with gold edging and logo and I don't like it..

These are equivalent carpet, if not better, and the company offer 15% off via our Gold member scheme...

Going to wash all the carpets in mine and then hit the lot with gallons of Scotchguard to try to keep the lovely Ivory looking good....

Also ordered a set of 8 iridium spark plugs from the states for £50, as opposed to £160 here....!!!!

[mr2lad]

The box on steering column is a sensor... facial sensor...it tracks your face movements whilst in cruise control and will beep at you and car will start to brake and slow down if you do not keep looking forward or if you nod off... hard to see in daylight but you will notice it illuminates slightly with purplish sensor lights .... 

edit.... quoted from Owners manual ls600h/LS600hL

driver monitor sensor

detects the direction the driver is facing,

the system determines whether the driver is facing forward

yet another edit lol

 

The system uses an algorithm to map the position of the driver’s facial features and monitors movement of the driver’s head. A CCD (charge-coupled device) camera is mounted on top of the steering column with six built-in near-infrared LED’s which allow the system to work accurately both day and night.

When the vehicle is started up, the system automatically plots the position of the driver’s facial features – eyes, nose and mouth – and measures the width and centre line of the face. If the driver’s head is turned away from the road at an angle of more than 15 degrees when the vehicle is moving and an obstacle is detected ahead, the system automatically activates the Pre- Crash warning buzzer and briefly applies the brakes to warn of the danger.

If this still fails to prompt action from the driver, the PCS engages emergency braking preparation and pre-tensioning of the front seatbelts.

These systems will be fitted as standard on the LS 600h and LS 600h L (long wheel base) as well as the LS 460, launched earlier this year.

[cruisermark]

I've always thought it was for the parking sensors lol!

[Bluesman]

20 hours ago, Haylands said:

I do love the Blackpool illuminations at night... just right.... Not a brilliant picture but the best my iPhone can do...!!!! 

What a lovely place to sit and while away the hours.

[Chris Skelton]

You guys! One with an SC430 lusting after a LS460. One with nice LS430 wanting.....etc.!

I guess the LS400 Ser 4 is now becoming a 'classic'? Let alone the older ones.

[Haylands]

Chris, Dreaming is what it's all about...

Mike, it is lovely, I may just sit in it on the drive as it's nicer than my front room...!!

Graham and Mark, there seems to be about four different levels of the PCS, mine has the lowest which just uses the front cruise sensor and will brake if it thinks your going to crash, some others have a rear sensor and also forward facing cameras each side of the interior mirror and infrared transmitters in the headlights.

[mr2lad]

Looking forward to seeing your finished car once your 100% happy with it...nice thread and brill pics included ... keep up the good work

[jonthetourist]

5 hours ago, Chris Skelton said:

You guys! One with an SC430 lusting after a LS460. One with nice LS430 wanting.....etc.!

I guess the LS400 Ser 4 is now becoming a 'classic'? Let alone the older ones.

It's not just the 460. It's the fact that it's an LS getting the Haylands treatment. The man is both obsessive and talented - a very rare combination. Don't take my word for it. Google the job he did on a knackered old Yaris for his daughter, or his Mercedes CL.

Then you add the colour combination and lack of a sunroof, and when the time comes . . . I'll be there.

Jon

 

PS I have never met Peter, but have read his write-ups with a sense of wonder and admiration. I have had a lot of work done to bring my 430 up to snuff, but I have to hire talented people to do it, lacking the skills myself.

[JimBobS]

I was bidding this car you beat me 

My bottle went but I was sorry I didn't bid higher

Good luck with the car, I hope it's a good one 

I have settled with a GS300

[Haylands]

33 minutes ago, jonthetourist said:

It's not just the 460. It's the fact that it's an LS getting the Haylands treatment. The man is both obsessive and talented - a very rare combination. Don't take my word for it. Google the job he did on a knackered old Yaris for his daughter, or his Mercedes CL.

Then you add the colour combination and lack of a sunroof, and when the time comes . . . I'll be there.

Jon

 

PS I have never met Peter, but have read his write-ups with a sense of wonder and admiration. I have had a lot of work done to bring my 430 up to snuff, but I have to hire talented people to do it, lacking the skills myself.

You're not getting it cheap just because you're being nice you know...

8 minutes ago, JimBobS said:

I was bidding this car you beat me 

My bottle went but I was sorry I didn't bid higher

Good luck with the car, I hope it's a good one 

I have settled with a GS300

To be honest I think I overpaid for it, by the time I have it where I want it I could have bought a nice one anyway....

I'm not doing it to make money though, it is just the spec and colour I wanted and that is worth a lot to me these days, my maximum bid was well over £6.000 so I'm glad you didn't bid it up anymore... 

I like the GS, went to look at a 400 but they are just a bit too small for me...

[JimBobS]

It's gone to a better man Haylands, I wouldn't have known where to start with the suspension issues.

Did you notice the maroon one that sold a couple of days earlier by the same seller for about £4500 very cheap.

It would be interesting to know how that faired

I sent a PM to ask for the reg to do a check and he never got back to me so I was dubious.

I think you've got a great car ,  its in good hands a fantastic thread as well.

I look forward to seeing the end product green with envy also I suspect 

 

 

[JimBobS]

Posted twice sorry

 

 

[Haylands]

James, The red one was still there, it had several warning lights on, not a nice colour combo IMHO and in worse condition, it's for sale on eBay for £6,500 at the moment, well it was a couple of days ago, very poor wheels, several areas of damage.... It's been cleaned up well for this latest advert...

This Lexus was registered on the V5 under Make as Lexus LS 460 and not just Lexus so a mot/tax check at DVLA shows no trace unless you submit it exactly as it is on the V5 and of course even he didn't sus that out... I went to see it before the auction finished and managed to spot all the issues apart from it's had a replacement n/s door mirror glass and it's not photochromic, it's just a plain one... that's a few hundred quid...!!! 

[JimBobS]

Ah the famous lexuschap has bought the maroon one suddenly the mileage is set in stone

I will get a LS460 eventually as its my dream car

I will need to be sure though because I do not have your knowledge about cars

Great thread gives me tips on what to look for and where to source parts

thanks

[Haylands]

Got quite a lot done today, 8 suspension arms and two ball joints changed... Finish it off tomorrow and change the discs and pads all round as well... I'll do a proper write up at the end but here's a taster for now...... love the shadows created by the multi bulbed LED work light...!!!

[cruisermark]

Looks like the work of man who knows what he is doing - I would be interested to find out how the drive/steering feels afterwards compared to before plz. - im getting a bit too much road feel through my steering and want to see if I can pin it down - I changed the track rod ends without much difference.

[Haylands]

 

The reason for the following was because the front end felt wrong, it was very floppy (floppier than normal) and it wandered a bit... you could see the top arms were worn and you could twist them without much effort...

It says in the workshop manual that to change the two top arms (the 460 has separate top arms as opposed to the earlier LS's wishbone) you have to remove the air strut assembly and to do that you have to remove the bottom arm and the track control arm so I thought I may as well change all four arms each side as at 116,000 miles and 9 years they will have seen better days...

Well, as usual with official workshop manuals, you don't "have" to remove the strut so all the bottom can be left complete if you need to change the top arms...!!!

The top arms were in the worst condition out of all of them...

You start with this...

First thing is to remove the clips that hold the brake pipe and wiring for the speed sensor, and on the offside, the pad warning sensor, then the two bolts that hold the caliper on and tie the caliper to the anti-roll bar with a couple of cable ties, then take the disc off, it doesn't have a retaining screw so is just held on by the wheel, they are very heavy 358mm discs so make sure it doesn't fall off when you remove the caliper as your foot won't like you for it..!!! Remove 4 bolts that hold the disc back plate on, best to take these off to avoid damage, they are aluminium so were in near perfect condition, just looking a bit aged...

The front hub is a large aluminium casting, as is the front subframe that holds the engine and attachment points for the bottom arm and control arm, they are all beautifully made and are very light, the bottom arm and two top arms are aluminium but the track control arm is cast steel. It is a pleasure to work on a Lexus again, I remember doing my brothers top wishbones on his Mk1 400 and cracking off the bolts and nuts in the wheelarch and then spinning them off with your fingers, his 400 was about 16 years old at the time. The quality and design mean that everything comes apart with minimal fuss... Having said that the wet looking patches on the pictures were not leaks from anything but some penetrating fluid, force of habit made me squirt some around before I started but it really wasn't necessary...

Back to it.. 

Remove the inner bolt that holds the bottom arm on and push the arm downwards, the subframe casting has a notch in it to release the arm towards the floor and not pulling it towards the wheel... then remove the track rod from the hub, a spring steel split pin (again, beautifully made and we reused them all as they were still in perfect condition) and a large flanged nut (the alloy hub has steel inserts where anything bolts to it so a large flanged nut is used to spread the loads over a large area of the aluminium encompassing the steel insert) Then remove the nut and bolt for the front track control arm, this was made easier by removing the plastic engine undertray. This bolt is a bit fiddly as when it is nearly out it hits the rack...!!! It's worse on the nearside, but if you put a pipe wrench on the arm and tilt it a few degrees you can wiggle it out (and get it back in with the new one) No mention of this issue in the manual... Finally remove the top two arms, two more splitpins and flange nuts.

I don't like using balljoint splitters, they break and rarely work well, a few good blows with a large hammer and balljoints will yield...

You then end up with a car looking like this

And this..

You know the top arms are gone when they drop like this... 

You can see above that the two top arms are bolted to two small frames that are then bolted to the inner wing, the manual says you have to remove the frames to remove the arms. The two top bolts that hold the frames on are prevented from coming out by the strut, hence, removal of the strut. However, if you remove the other two bolts (front frame) and one bolt (rear frame) you can get a spanner on the top bolts to loosen them and then pivot the frame away from the strut, it is then "just" possible to remove the bolts that hold the upper arms on. 

This is a close up of the frame

You can see the top bolt that is loosened, it then pivots forward like this...

(Yes I know I should wear gloves, I really hate them though...!!!)

These are the top two arms, you can see shards of rubber and a split all around the central pin

It didn't take much to pull this out, it is supposed to be bonded to the rubber...

Track control arm... you can see the splits starting and it was movable with hand pressure, the new one wasn't...

Bottom arm, inner bush, again starting to wear and offset slightly...

Bottom arm strut fixing, squashed a bit...

To be fare the bottom arm had many good years left in it and the control arm wasn't too bad either...

Big hammer again to remove the bottom arm and control arm from the hub and then the fun starts, removing the large ball joint that locates the bottom arm, it was a two man job and a very big hammer, a brass drift and some heat from oxy acetylene, heat the alloy hub up, being careful of the bearing which is pushed into the hub so not easily removed, they do provide a recess in the bottom of the balljoint to use a drift in, several large blows and it was out...

The shape of the upright means it won't fit under a hydraulic press so we used a couple of large (52mm IIRC) sockets and pushed the new joint in with a large vice, again heating the alloy to get some expansion, with hindsight I'd have put the balljoints in the freezer..

Reassembly is, as they say, a reversal, I fitted the arms to the car first, a bit of faffing with the control arm and that bolt but it will go in without removing the steering rack, the top arms need to be bolted on in the correct alignment for when the car is at normal height, there is no way to tighten these bolts up with weight on the suspension so I had a "best guess" at this

I was within an inch, so not too bad...

Once all the arms are bolted to the car, offer the hub up and bolt it all back together...

New bottom arm, Strut is bolted where the upside down R is, then moving right is the drop link for the ARB then the height sensor fixing and finally the connection to the front subframe.

New control arm with the wiring to the hub attached, just out of focus in the foreground is one of the large flange nuts..  

After putting it all back together it was onto the brakes, the old discs had seen better days... The brakes felt fine though...

I opened the new boxes of EBC brakes, a full set of four new discs and front and rear pads in their basic range, these are excellent for normal road use and the pads are low dust ones so even better....

This is where I found out that there are two different sizes of front disc fitted to the 2007 LS460...!!!! and I'd ordered the wrong ones, to be fair it doesn't say anywhere on the EBC web site that there are two different sizes and it doesn't give the disc size either so how was I supposed to know...!!! I phoned them and they were more than helpful and put the correct set in the post for next day delivery but I did have to pay and then claim a refund when I return the wrong ones... The woman said "It happens all the time"... WELL PUT THE SIZE ON THE LISTING THEN...!!! Rant over...

So, while waiting a day for the new ones to arrive I thought I would do a summers job I had lined up, luckily I had already ordered the caliper stickers so the following morning it was back to my mates garage with sanding and painting gear... 

It's easy to do the calipers without pads or discs, just bolt the caliper back on and away you go... I gave them a clean with some brake cleaner, excellent quality aluminium, these don't look 9 years old...

First give the calipers a good sanding, I used a DA sander with 120grit pads... make sure you round off any sharp corners, it helps the paint stay on longer

Then a light coat of Acid etch primer, just dust on a few coats until you have complete coverage, I used a hot air gun to warm the calipers up first, aids adhesion and drying... Then stick on the caliper stickers... (no I'm not going mad)

Then paint it with your chosen colour, Metallic black in this case... again just dust on a few light coats until it is all covered, out with the hot air gun and give them a good baking moving the gun over the surface all the time, keep it in one place and you will burn the paint... Then, very carefully pick an edge of the stickers up with a sharp blade and pull the stickers off..

To reveal this...

Then give it a good six coats of UHT clear coat drying between each coat... and the finished result is a well protected caliper and the stickers won't fall off...!!!

Rear is the same with a different sticker

I sanded, etch primed and stonchipped the back plates

Forgot to take an after picture...!!!

This is the paint I used, got it from Halfords with my 15% club discount card, I had the clear UHT paint already but I think they sell that as well... You must etch prime aluminium or the paint will fall off in a short time...

I love the metallic black, the 460 is not really a car that would look good with red or yellow...!!!

Then sat about twiddling my thumbs waiting for the new front discs to arrive... they turned up at 4.30pm so my mate did one side and I did the other, discs on, pads in, wheels on, off the two post lift, settle the suspension then onto the four post ramp and fully tightened the lower arm and control arm to subframe bolts so the bushes are in the correct alignment...

I didn't get a chance to take a picture with it all back together so you will have to wait...

Mark asked above how it feels, well... better and worse...!!! let me explain...

The tyres are badly abused, one has at least 10 large chunks out of the sidewall and they are well out of balance so the wheel wobble is even worse. The play in the front suspension was absorbing a lot of the wobble... on the plus side the steering is more precise and the front end wobble is much better...

I took it for a four wheel align this morning, it didn't pull and ran straight but that was because it had 5 degrees of toe in on the front, even both sides the rear was 3 degrees out from the front, they pulled it back and got them all within half a degree, the tolerance is 1 degree, it now feels even more solid and drives nicely up to about 50 when the wheel wobble starts...

So this afternoon 4 of these were ordered, and another mate will fit them next Saturday as they are coming direct from Dunlop and won't be here till Wednesday

 

It says on the Dunlop website that these are 102 load rating but the ones I've ordered and all the adverts I can find say it's a 98 load rating which is correct for the Lexus, the 102 wouldn't matter much but it would be a tad harder....

So, a fair way towards sorting it out now...