IS to GS

[Dixgas]

Hi Guys

After three IS's switching to a GS, picking up a 300h executive edition in Sonic Titanium/black leather on monday,

Will post some pics.

D

 

[Zotto]

Well done :)

[Dixgas]

Thanks Zotto, looking forward to monday.

[Jamesf1]

let us know your thoughts IS vs GS. I went from on 09 IS250 to a 13 GS250 and I love it. even smoother, more refined and extra space is great

[polish]

Quote

hi guys first post on gs sight ,changed my rx450h lux for GS300h. so far I am very pleased with the car ,wow done 500m already it was my xmass box to me rx was getting to big to park being a 13 plate got a good deal from lexus,car is far far better than the rx smoother quieter ect so far,on'ly miss boot space or rather the hatch back facility but hay, I think I came out topps  .polish

 

[steveledzep]

On 20/01/2017 at 3:16 PM, Jamesf1 said:

 I went from on 09 IS250 to a 13 GS250 and I love it. even smoother, more refined and extra space is great

That is exactly one of the changes I am considering.

 

Not sure whether to go for an RX instead though ?

 

I need to test drive both.

[GSLV6]

This may help, as I've driven all three cars being discussed and owned two of them:

The RX is a completely different beast and really does take a lot of thought and reasoning before deciding. Why? because the driving experience and driving styles for the two cars are completely different.

The IS is a great mid sized exec-class car, and does everything you could want of such a car.  The move to a GS primarily gives your more cabin room and refinement with the choice of more engines. The 450h is deceptively fast and a lot more powerful tan the IS300 for example. If opting for the F-sport, the 4 wheel steering and stiffened suspension make it a very dynamic drive, although a little firm for our pot-holed roads.  One thing that may disappoint with the GS is lack of boot space. As the batteries are stored behind the rear seats you sacrifice a LOT of space compared with something like the Gen3 GS non hybrid(my favourite GS of all)  so really need to consider a roof rack and rails for family holidays.  Horses for courses, but the only way I'd step up from the IS is to go to the 450h GS otherwise, I don't see many real world advantages other than more toys and being a bit more cosseted with more room for greater running costs.  The ride is very good and is very smooth and quiet in the GS as you'd expect.

The RX is completely different to drive.  To get anything close to even 70% of the quoted fuel economy figures for a start, you have to drive like a nun, plus have mechanical sympathy, avoiding unnecessary braking or acceleration and driving to keep the car in the Eco range for much of the time.  It does reward such driving though as it becomes a very relaxed place to be when you're not in a hurry, and then you really get to appreciate it's strengths. You also have to give thought as to which model you choose as there is a significant difference, to my mind anyway, to the driving experience depending on which you pick.

For example, if we're talking 3RX and not the latest versions, going to an entry level SE is not to be recommended unless you pick one up cheap.  It lacks much of what comes standard on luxury or advance models  They are the pick of the bunch for value and kit.  The Advance gives larger wheels and tyres, sunroof or pan roof and a few other toys, with options of ML stereo etc etc.  They all have excellent load space and all feel very refined to drive.  Being seated higher up improves observation (obviously) and once experienced, becomes a major draw to the model.  The driving seat and passenger seat are superbly comfortable.  I preferred them to the firmer seating of the GS.  The dash layout, whilst a little dated is less cluttered although some of the buttons are awkward and almost inaccessible when driving without taking your eyes off the road which is really annoying.  On board storage space is plentiful, and rear passenger room better than the GS, plus rear seats recline, as well as folding down creating a whopping 1.7 cubic metres of storage space (approximately).  Performance for the 450h is very brisk for a 2.2 tonne vehicle.  Lexus claim 7.9 seconds 0-100Kmh (0-62).  GPS testing by independent reviewers work out at a full second less than this to 60 which I can attest is nearer the mark.

The F-sport is a good compromise between the more sporty drive of the GS and has much reduced body roll over the SE, Lux and Advance models meaning that it corners almost flat, although on bumpy roads, you still get shaken left to right a lot as if driving a big high van...which you are in effect.  What it has over the GS is auto 4WD, so has great traction, although it's not a true off roader.  For rutted tracks etc, or more challenging driving conditions it does offer an advantage.

The F-sport RX also offers LED headlamps, and a head up display both of which are a real advantage, as is the added "sport" mode which sharpens up throttle response for more instant shove, although ALL RX models have an inbuilt lag in throttle response due, apparently, to some US lawsuit (which allegedly was brought about due to carpets snagging under throttle pedals, something now cured).

GS or RX will depend on your needs.  For a family, the RX wins hands down. It is more comfortable for 4 or 5 people, roomier and more practical and has some driving advantages such as the improved observation from the elevated driving position.  It sacrifices some performance, but is no slouch and remains in GTi territory on acceleration and overtaking.

The 4GS is a more dynamic drive with a different (more cluttered) layout but more up to date in many ways and is a fair bit quicker due to different tuning offering a 50BHP advantage and is lighter but is 2WD.  It is compromised in boot space and rear passengers do better than in the IS but not as well as in the RX which has no transmission tunnel as there's driveshaft to the rear.

The final consideration is size.  The RX is HUGE. You soon become aware of it's width.  those few extra inches make a big difference and you will have to slow down and take extra care to avoid your wing mirrors being clipped by oncoming traffic on narrow roads, to avoid curbing the wheels and when choosing parking spots.  I never use supernarket parking spots as I've had too many incidents in the past of ignorant people banging trolleys into my car, or opening doors on it, or even (once last year) someone driving into the side of my car, then driving off.  Supermarkets are NOt the natural habitat of an RX.  It'll come a cropper sooner or later of you use them unless using one of the larger parent and child slots if you have young children.

Finally, the RX takes more cleaning and you will need a step ladder or stool to get to the roof!

Personally, as we have a sporty small car, I don't miss the dynamic driving of the GS but do miss it's effortless and refined (non CVT) drive.  It was a true GT car in the original sense, with load space, refinement, performance and decent handling.  The new 4GS and 5GS sacrifice load space so are not true GT cars and also arguably are not as refined in the drive as a normal auto (Having lived with the CVT for a while, I still prefer the auto, but the CVT is an efficient means of power transfer and has other advantages).

You pays your money and makes your choice but test drives won't tell you the strengths of the RX as it takes longer to adjust to its driving style.  I find that I get from A to B much more relaxed than I did in my GS, yet it offers substantial shove when needed for overtakes, and I wouldn't be without that load space anymore, whether for tip runs, transporting luggage, sports gear, my work stuff or whatever else.  The F-Sport for me was different enough from the Luxury models to recommend it in handling, more instant shove and more useful toys, so is a different enough driving experience to say it's a better all rounder than just about any other Lexus vehicle, just bear in mind its size when choosing and you won't regret it.

[Zotto]

Just to defend hybrid GS, trunk space has been improved with Battery pack underneath, even if rear  seats can't  still be folded, and GS 450h, with a 0-63 of 5.9 seconds is a rocket! In 300h version, with 2,5 litres engine, it is a bit slower than a RX 450h, but gains a lot of mpg. I agree RX offer more space, but GS is a lovely place to be, and one of the most silent cars (accordingly to a site I linked time ago).  As the topic is IS vs GS, only speaking about performance, they depends from engine choice, the 2 hybrid 300h models are almost same.

[GSLV6]

2 hours ago, Zotto said:

Just to defend hybrid GS, trunk space has been improved with battery pack underneath, even if rear  seats can't  still be folded, and GS 450h, with a 0-63 of 5.9 seconds is a rocket! In 300h version, with 2,5 litres engine, it is a bit slower than a RX 450h, but gains a lot of mpg. I agree RX offer more space, but GS is a lovely place to be, and one of the most silent cars (accordingly to a site I linked time ago).  As the topic is IS vs GS, only speaking about performance, they depends from engine choice, the 2 hybrid 300h models are almost same.

The 2014 model I looked at still had a small boot (much smaller than the Mk3 GS) and no central ski flap. That alone would preclude it for me, and did.  It was the deciding factor.  Had it been more practical, I may have bought one over the GS, but it just didn't strike me as a very good family car for lack of storage space. The LS didn't seem much better! That, for me is really unforgivable these days when comparing with  Mercedes boots, or Audi's or VW's or Skoda Superbs and especially Volvo S60's an Mondeos.  They all have much more load space and are more family friendly as a result.

That said, the GS was a rocketship and a very refined ride, but not quite as comfy to me as the RX which was equally quiet and refined.

[Zotto]

If you need space, RX is the right choice. Besides, Lexus does not make hatchback cars.

[Carl911]

I drive a is300h and whilst it was a great all rounder I thought I should also try out the gs300h.

i expected it to feel under powered being a larger car but in practice I thought the engine felt smoother and better placed in the GS.

its not as quick as my gs450 but in reality you never use the power 80% of the time as commuting in traffic governs you to set speeds often in conjested situations so for the majority of your drive the only real benefit is how comfortably and quiet your car takes you to work. For that purpose most of lexus range achieve top marks.

carl

[Zotto]

... and don't forget great difference in mpg.

[Dixgas]

First thing was to alter the lane changing flasher from the default 3 to 5 which is much more relevant.

[capese21]

16 hours ago, Carl911 said:

i expected it to feel under powered being a larger car but in practice I thought the engine felt smoother and better placed in the GS

I have a GS and previously a IS300H Fsport. I agree with you, although essentially the same drive train it seems even better in the GS. imho because  the sound insulation is better you dont here the engine so much so performance seems better.

I am consistently getting better MPG to. 

The boot is plenty big enough for us and I have no need for a ski flap. Dont SKI cannot think of a worse "holiday". Friends go on them & come back with sprains & various injuries & exhausted!!  Saying that they fly there so leave the car at home and hire the skis at the resort.

On one occasion when contemplating buying some long work tops, I  may have folded the seats flat, I just used the wife's estate car instead.

I didn't buy a Lexus to fetch large loads from B&Q!!

 

Ed

 

[Jamesf1]

On 27/01/2017 at 10:24 PM, steveledzep said:

That is exactly one of the changes I am considering.

 

Not sure whether to go for an RX instead though ?

 

I need to test drive both.

I cant comment on an RX as never driven one, but this is what I've found to be the plus points of a GS vs IS (note previous gen IS vs current GS)

Size - good on the inside and whilst a big car you have t be concious of the size whilst parking but its never been a problem.

Refinement is a big step on in the GS. Mpg is a little worse, as you'd expect, but for the same power-train in a bigger carnot much different. I averaged 29 MPG in the IS and get 27mpg in the GS. Performance slightly better in the IS but little in it. However, in sport mode, the GS v6 induction noise is enhanced and is pretty cool at full throttle in high revs. 

Overall the GS is more comfortable cruiser than the IS. Mine is a 13 plate Luxury spec with the Mark Levinson stereo (which is brilliant) and comes with the bigger split LCD screen (which is also excellent). Sat nav a bit of a faff to use - I should probably read the manual though! The boot on the GS250 is huge. 

[steveledzep]

Thanks James.  After reading a lot of the RX threads on here at the moment, I'd virtually decided on the GS250, you have just added weight to my decision.

 

The performance of my IS250C is adequate for my needs and being a convertible is actually heavier than the GS250 by 90kgs according to specs.  So, I think it reasonable to expect very similar performance and mpg from a GS250.

[Zotto]

Giving a try to hybrid driving could make you to valuate better the difference from a "traditional" vehicle.

[Eire Lexus]

I made the jump last week from IS300h to GS300h. The GS is absolutely fantastic, a lot more comfortable and surprisingly economical despite extra weight. The comfort levels are terrific. I really liked the IS but I now love the GS.

[GSLV6]

The GS is a lovely car, a great place to be in and drive.  The only problem with hybrid models is boot space, although for most people it's adequate and there are roof bars and roof boxes if needed for holidays etc.

 

21 hours ago, Jamesf1 said:

I cant comment on an RX as never driven one, but this is what I've found to be the plus points of a GS vs IS (note previous gen IS vs current GS)

Size - good on the inside and whilst a big car you have t be concious of the size whilst parking but its never been a problem.

Refinement is a big step on in the GS. Mpg is a little worse, as you'd expect, but for the same power-train in a bigger carnot much different. I averaged 29 MPG in the IS and get 27mpg in the GS. Performance slightly better in the IS but little in it. However, in sport mode, the GS v6 induction noise is enhanced and is pretty cool at full throttle in high revs. 

Overall the GS is more comfortable cruiser than the IS. Mine is a 13 plate Luxury spec with the Mark Levinson stereo (which is brilliant) and comes with the bigger split LCD screen (which is also excellent). Sat nav a bit of a faff to use - I should probably read the manual though! The boot on the GS250 is huge. 

I agree with you James.

I've owned both and currently drive the RX.  It's not as smooth on bumpy surfaces or refined feeling as the GS due to firmer suspension to cope with the 2.2 tonne mass (F-Sport model).  As a driver's car for enthusiastic driving, the GS was more enjoyable, although it still reminded you through some detachment from the road, that this was not its natural state, as it is more about being wafted to your destination in refinement.  I really thought that the MK3 GS had the edge on refinement (as a drive) over the 4GS mainly because wheel sizes and profiles plus suspension all added to a firmer ride with the newer model, plus I preferred the older 6 speed auto to the CVT.

The GS I had for several years had a character about it that  was almost human in it's traits!  It reminded me of a posh butler (not that I'd know) which turned it's nose up at vulgar noise or unrefined driving and rewarded smooth driving with the sort of journey that left you as fresh on arrival as when you set out, even over long distances.  It was reassuring in road manners, spacious, quiet and never made a fuss.  "would sir like to overtake?....no problem...." several seconds later you were gently but firmly whisked past offending traffic with surprising yet refined urge that never and the engine screaming blue murder.  It was effortless (3.0 V6).  The GS450h that I drove made a little more fuss noise-wise due to the CVT transmission in such situations.  On a day to day basis, I preferred my non-hybrid 3.0V6 by some margin but that had to be balanced by the lower fuel economy (the Mk3 did 27mpg average although motorway runs saw 38) and higher taxation costs, plus increased service items due to age.

On the whole, the comparison between IS and GS, to me, is that the GS is a "grown up" IS with more room, more refinement, and in the case of the 450, more performance.  It retains some, but not all of the best aspects of the Mk3 GS300, and for refinement and comfort, it's as good as anything on the market at the price and probably a lot more reliable.

The RX shares more in common with the GS than the IS...a lot more.  It is higher (obviously) but the advantages and the experience of being higher up are not apparent until you drive one, and is a strong draw with its good all round visibility and road presence.  It has good performance for such a large car, and in real world terms and not brochure figures, out-paces a surprising number of vehicles.  From a standstill the acceleration is almost breathtaking for a 2 tonne monster and I think betters the older GS300 to 60.  It is very large though and would become a pain in the derriere for regular town driving as the length and the width preclude it from many parking spaces, if you wanted the side panels to remain un-dented or scratched by the more thoughtless (and sadly plentiful) car park users.   The NX would be a better town SUV if you needed the space that the GS lacks in the boot department, especially as the seats fold down.  The RX has cavernous boot space, almost 1.8 cubic metres with seats down.  It is very refined to drive, and like the GS, it wafts you to your destination in luxurious comfort.  It is a more expensive proposition to run as it average less mpg and decent tyres can set you back a few hundred a corner.  It is a mnore detached drive which makes you feel like every journey is like a simulation where the requirement is to arrive silently, saving fuel (using a smooth driving style) and in total comfort.  It  is genuinely calming and you feel less wound up or threatened by the behaviour of other road users because driving it is such a pleasure, that speed is irrelevant in some ways, as it's the journey that matters.  Rear passengers especially benefit with great legroom and no transmission tunnel plus reclining seats.

Horses for courses.  If you want to chose on a general run about in urban settings and need more space potential than the IS or GS has, the RX would be my choice.  If you do a lot of commuting and mixed driving, the GS300 or 450h would be my pick.  For young families, the GS or the RX. For load lugging, some off road potential and shear practicality, the RX wins hands down without sacrificing too much in performance for things like overtakes.

They're all different but in some ways complementary choices (ie GS and RX V's IS and NX). They're all smart choices given you pick the right one for your needs.  You're unlikely to be disappointed whatever your choice.

[Funkyboy]

I test drove a GS300h and was really dissapointed with the ride quality. I found it quite unsettled except when on a motorway.

I had convinced myself this was the car for me ticked all the boxes low tax, petrol good fuel economy but wouldn't have been able to live with the ride quality.

final nail was the servicing costs both the A and B service was only an oil and filter change (brake fluid on B service) and visual checks. For this Lexus wanted £269 and £469!

When I asked about the B service I was told it's a full service? When I asked but what actually gets changed it was oil and filter and brake fluid?

while I was there a guy was telling me his car was in for a service and they where doing it while he waited. They did the B service in 60 mins including a wash and vac but still charged him £469? Obviously a lot of dealers are the same but I think people would be shocked if they knew what actually gets done on their cars while they are having a 'full service'

[Carl911]

13 minutes ago, Funkyboy said:

I test drove a GS300h and was really dissapointed with the ride quality. I found it quite unsettled except when on a motorway.

I had convinced myself this was the car for me ticked all the boxes low tax, petrol good fuel economy but wouldn't have been able to live with the ride quality.

final nail was the servicing costs both the A and B service was only an oil and filter change (brake fluid on B service) and visual checks. For this Lexus wanted £269 and £469!

When I asked about the B service I was told it's a full service? When I asked but what actually gets changed it was oil and filter and brake fluid?

while I was there a guy was telling me his car was in for a service and they where doing it while he waited. They did the B service in 60 mins including a wash and vac but still charged him £469? Obviously a lot of dealers are the same but I think people would be shocked if they knew what actually gets done on their cars while they are having a 'full service'

I used to service my own cars many years ago and the only reason I take mine to the main dealer is because of the warranty. 

Im fully aware of how little is actually done in a service.

i always find it ridiculous that even replacing an air filter seems to be an additional cost.

the only real benefit is they do seem to thouroughly check for any potential problems or wear when it goes into the ramp . This highlights any pending problems which I then often take else wheee to be fixed.

i have a lexus service agreement which softens the amount over the year so makes it a little easier to swallow. Rest assured soon as the car warranty runs out it can go to a good third party garage at half the price for just as good a job.

carl

[marrat]

I have a question for the people who went from IS to GS, concerning driving and handling. I've test driven both, this is obviously not nearly long enough to get to know the cars. Driving the GS300H after the IS300H, I lost all sense of dynamic driving. The car felt a lot bigger and drove like a boat (an exaggeration to make a point). Did you guys have the same experience?

[Funkyboy]

45 minutes ago, marrat said:

I have a question for the people who went from IS to GS, concerning driving and handling. I've test driven both, this is obviously not nearly long enough to get to know the cars. Driving the GS300H after the IS300H, I lost all sense of dynamic driving. The car felt a lot bigger and drove like a boat (an exaggeration to make a point). Did you guys have the same experience?

Yes I thought the Is300h drove much better than the GS300h. Also felt more screwed together than the GS

[capese21]

1 hour ago, Carl911 said:

i have a lexus service agreement which softens the amount over the year so makes it a little easier to swallow. Rest assured soon as the car warranty runs out it can go to a good third party garage at half the price for just as good a job.

carl

Same here, saying that they do also do a  Hybrid system healthcheck included in the price. They also email a video of a mechanic checking over and last itme found one horn was below spec and replaced it free. A tpms sensor also failed and they spotted that to again replaced immediately under warranty. 

I have an extended warranty so have to go to Lexus. A full Lexus service history is worth something at trade in time.

41 minutes ago, marrat said:

The car felt a lot bigger and drove like a boat (an exaggeration to make a point). Did you guys have the same experience?

It is a little bigger than the IS300H and as i went from an Fsport my GS for sure drove different but I prefer comfort over a hard sport suspension.

Quote

 

I had convinced myself this was the car for me ticked all the boxes low tax, petrol good fuel economy but wouldn't have been able to live with the ride quality.

final nail was the servicing costs both the A and B service was only an oil and filter change (brake fluid on B service) and visual checks. For this Lexus wanted £269 and £469!

 

 

Main dealer servicing is expensive for not much but they have you by the short & curlies if you want the extended warranty to be valid.

Once out I will probably go independent.

I find the ride quality to be excellent on all surfaces. Superb seats to. Depends what you are comparing it to for me it was the hard Fsport suspension and similar on my car before that. 

 

Ed

[Dixgas]

" I thought the IS 300h drove much better than the GS300h, also felt more screwed together than the GS "

Well I beg to differ, after 3 years with a 3gen 250 have now, admittedly after just 250 miles in my GS 300h I find it a much more refined drive, have just arrived back after a little drive through the lakes and found it handles ( for a large saloon ) very well and the ride is much smoother than the IS, its also beautiful finished inside.

My GS is on 17 wheels.