Potential Buyer of NX300h

ElectricPaul · January 15, 2017

Evening all. I've been lurking here for a few days to educate myself on the finer points of NX ownership as a potential future owner.

Just to fill you in on my current wheels - I have a 2014 Subaru Forester XT which is very quick and very practical. It's the quintessential SUV - i.e Sports Utility Vehicle - in that it is very sporty, very utilitarian and a vehicle. My major gripe with it is that it is a bit too utilitarian. Despite huge strides in recent years Subaru struggle to escape their heritage of building incredibly reliable, go-anywhere, no-nonsense workhorses, which is of course a huge strength in many ways. I was recently in a 'conversation' with a member of a Subaru forum I frequent about suitable replacements for my Forester. He suggested I look at a Subaru Outback (he had a Forester XT until about a year ago and replaced it with an Outback), but he also mentioned that he runs an RX450h as well as the Outback and had good experience of Lexus, running a number of different models as company cars until he retired and was a big fan.

Bearing in mind that I usually buy Japanese automatic petrol cars ( 5 of my last 7 cars have been Japanese; 2x Honda, 1x Nissan and 2x Subaru) I thought it was worth a look. I didn't fancy the price of a new RX - but what a great looking car! - so I arranged a test drive of a 2.5 year old RX450h Advance. I loved the comfort and build quality so arranged to go back for another drive with my wife. She loved the seats, but thought it a bit big and the final nail in the coffin for her was the beige carpets in the boot. We've previously had similar and regretted it. I thought I had wasted my time and hers until, on the way out, she noticed an NX. I had paid no attention to this model previously as I assumed it was not her type of car. We sat in it and she loved it (apart from the black headlining). We went for a short accompanied drive in a NX300h F Sport - shorter than I would have liked because the salesman had not been expecting it. I was generally impressed, but my test drive raised a number of questions that NX owners here may be able to help me with.

Reading this forum, two main issues seem to arise

1) is the performance of the hybrid adequate, or as some think, is it a little underpowered for the weight of the car?

2) is the suspension a bit 'crashy' over potholes and drain covers and a bit unsettled over poor and broken surfaces? Supplementary to this - is the F Sport worse?

The answer to these two questions holds the key to whether I go ahead with purchase. I accept that I would initially find the performance of the 300h a bit disappointing coming from a 240 hp car that only weighs 1600kg, but would it prove so different I would regret the change? Very subjective of course, but I welcome your views.

On the question of ride quality, one of my reasons for considering a change to the Forester is it's ride quality. It is best described as 'jittery' at slow speeds on poor or broken surfaces, due to the spring and damper rates. I think this is in a large part due to Subaru tuning the suspension so that it performs well off-road as well as on-road. It is brilliant off-road, but you pay the price in normal driving, although it's fine at higher speeds and acceptably compliant. As I don't imagine the NX has been designed with a lot of off-roading in mind, I was hoping it would be soft enough to be comfortable, but just firm enough to handle well. I'm not expecting much am I?!

I'm anticipating that many will tell me to get an extended test drive, which I intend to do, although my local dealer only has the F Sport as a demonstrator and I can't take out any of the secondhand stock unaccompanied on trade plates. Also, I know from bitter experience that even 24 hour test drives are not always long enough to 'get a handle' on the true characteristics of a car. The experience of many on this forum is invaluable, but I still can't reach any conclusion, from what I've read here, whether the normal suspension tuning is worse than the F Sport or not and it may be difficult to get a back-to-back test of Luxury and F Sport at the same dealer.

Hopefully, NX drivers out there will be keen to share their experiences of ownership with me. Apologies for the length of this post - I want to get it right.

ElectricPaul · January 15, 2017

I should have added to the above post that I consider that the performance of the 2.0 turbo in my XT Forester is probably too much for the chassis and the reason I went with it over the 2.0 n/a car was that the latter was an 'emissions special' to keep the VED reasonable. The 2.5 n/a engine (as currently in the Outback) would have been great. I've driven that engine in the Outback and it is fine, but that car actually weighs 12kg less than the XT and 200 - 300kg less than an NX 300h Luxury.

rayaans · January 16, 2017

Only you can decide on the ride quality and performance after an extended test drive. Its totally subjective, some will say its fine, others not so much.

As for the F-Sport, theoretically it should be stiffer than the other models, practically, some owners have said the opposite. However, the F-Sport does handle better if thats what you want.

Also worth knowing that the difference in size between the RX and NX is marginal.

DJP · January 16, 2017

I agree with rayaans, it is totally subjective and only your definitions of comfort,harsh,performance etc will be relevant.

The F Sport is firmer than the others but I find it absolutely fine and not tiring or hard work at all. Some (mine included) have Adaptable Variable Suspension (AVS) which adjusts automatically to the road conditions and driving style. You can tell if the car has it as there is an additional setting shown on the rotary dial called Sport+. Select this and it further tightens the suspension. Some dealers knowledge is better than others, so check the rotary dial, don't rely on the dealer telling you it has it.

Does it make any difference to the ride? Selecting Sport+ makes no difference to the ride quality for me, I really can't tell the difference. Whether having AVS makes a difference in day to day driving, who knows? I haven't driven one with immediately followed by one without. In any event, we'd be back to square one with the subjectivity of it all anyway!

The performance, more subjectivity! It certainly isn't slow, but neither does it break any records either. However, the hybrid system can give the impression that it's straining when in fact it's not. Put your foot down and the engine gives full rpms and keeps them there until you've decided you're going quite fast enough. The noise, which is hated by the journo's is simply the way the hybrid set up works. I'm not sure about the other models but the F Sport has Adjustable Sound Control (ASC) which enables you to feed in fake engine noise linked to what the engine is doing. A bit of fun for a couple of minutes but gimmicky thereafter IMO.

I've never driven a Subaru so have no idea how the two compare but for my money the NX is a very well balanced car. Extended test drive over as many of your normal routes as you can sounds like the best bet!

Keep us posted [emoji846]

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GSLV6 · January 16, 2017

Having tested the new NX and a 2 year old RX, I bought a 2 year olf RX F-Sport and would I'd pick the RX every day of the week if a more comfortable utilitarian vehicle was called for simply for the greater load space, passenger space, ground clearance and extra power. The NX I found too compromised in load area, but it was very nicely finished, very comfortable and handled well enough. As to speed, I personally would think you'd miss the performance of your Subaru and its off road capabilities if indeed you used it much off-road. The NX is more a crossover compact SUV with some off-road ability rather than a purpose built go-anywhere 4x4 like the Forrester (which, along with the Outback, are excellent off road and fast on it!).

However, the NX will be light years ahead of the Subarus for build quality, refinement, toys etc and more economical to run, by far. If these things matter, then it's a smart choice. If you want performance though, you would have to look for or order a 2 litre turbo-petrol F-Sport version. That is quite fast, and is lighter than the 3.0 hybrid which has to lug around a 2.5 litre engine plus electric motors and hybrid drive.

RE the RX...you can have a black or tan (yuck!) interior if you want it, and without beige carpets! Mine is a black interior with black carpets. The RX won't disappoint in terms of performance. For it's 2.2t bulk, it can accurately be described as deceptively/frighteningly* (delete as appropriate) quick . *( in that it picks up speed rather quicker than you'd expect for its size and often sees the newcomer diving on the stop peddle before the corner/tree/cliff comes up!). It is a lot quicker than the 300h, but there's probably not a lot in it between the 450h and the NX 2.0t.

You haven't yet said what the primary use is for, ie commuting, or general family car or off roader with general family duties. For off roading, as you know, tyre choice if everying but neither the RX nor the NX have enough ground clearance to be considered serious off road contenders. With the right tyre choice, they're more than capable for muddy ruts, fire trails and general off road where loads of ground clearance isn't an issue. From what you say, if your wife is making the choice and you accept some of the compromises, your best bet might be the 2 litre turbo NX, but if she gets used to the size of the RX (my wife adapted to it very fast because it's so easy to drive and has excellent all round visibility), then I'd recommend a post 2012 face lift 450h F-Sport. The handling on the F-sport sets it apart from the luxury and advance models and it's worth the extra for that and the higher spec.

Bodmeister · January 16, 2017

I've got a NX Premier. I actually preferred the ride of the F Sport but unfortunately when I ordered the car , the Premier options weren't available on the F sport so I went with the Premier. The ride can get really fidgety on uneven/potholed roads but is superb on motorways. It corners well for a heavy car.

The interior is screwed together brilliantly. High quality materials in all the right places.

I don't like the Lexus infotainment system. I would prefer a touchscreen.

I have averaged 37mpg over 22 months of ownership. I'm happy with that.

As mentioned earlier, the drivetrain does get noisy when accelerating hard but that's just how it's set up. It settles down nicely when the required speed is achieved and you can just sit back and cruise.

Best thing to do would be to take a day off and arrange a 24 hour test drive. You can play with it to your hearts content and then make a decision.

I am trading mine in March for a RX Premier. Main reason for a change was space( 2 young kids), more poke and more luxury!

I played about with a Tesla Model S and a Cayenne Turbo before placing a firm order. Both great cars but both VERY expensive and the Tesla's interior was inferior compared to even the NX ( imho!). The new interior is better I think but too late now to change my mind.

Good Luck.

ElectricPaul · January 16, 2017

Thanks everyone for helpful replies.

Regarding size rayaans, my reading of the dimensions gives the NX as nearly 6" shorter, 1.5" narrower and 3" lower than the 'old' RX. I consider that significant enough to be noticeable.

DJP, can you switch off the ASC. on my previous short ride in an F Sport I found it annoying. I'm used to a CVT gearbox with the Subaru and like it, so I have no problem with the way the hybrid system operates regarding apparent lack of gears.

GSLV6, being retired I fortunately no longer need to commute. Although I don"t off-road, I find increased ride height and AWD capability useful where I live in rural Dorset where we suffer flooded roads, potholes, general road damage and fords. My car usage is probably about 60% of round trips of up to 15 or 20 miles to my local town, 20% up to 100 or 150 miles and 20% longer trips of say 300 to 500 miles (the latter 2 or 3 times a year).

Bodmeister, you mention you prefer the ride of the F Sport and then say you find the ride fidgety on uneven/potholed roads. Do you mean the ride of your Premier is fidgety, or is it the F Sport that's guilty? I'm interested in your comments because, as I said in my earlier post, it's what i described as the jittery ride at slow speeds on poor surfaces that annoys me about my Forester! It sounds as though the NX may suffer similar traits.

Anyway, I've arranged for a 24 hour test in a NX300h F Sport. Unfortunately, my local dealer does not have a Premier or Luxury model as a demonstrator so I won't be able to test the two different suspension setups back to back.

I'll report back.

DJP · January 16, 2017

The ASC can be turned off. The dial is by your left knee.

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Bodmeister · January 16, 2017

My findings were: Premier ( doesn't come with AVS anyway) was fidgety over uneven/potholed roads, buttery smooth on motorway and smooth roads.

F Sport with AVS( can tell by sport + mode) . Non fidgety over uneven/potholed roads but noisy on motorway, smooth roads. This is just MY opinion! Others may have different opinions. Hence, drive it for 24/48 hours over different surfaces and then decide. Ask them if you can have the two variants over a couple of days. They both handle VERY differently!

Edit: Sorry, didn't read your post fully re availability of Luxury/Premier.

In that case if you like the F Sport regarding its ride, I would personally stick with it. But , if you like being objective, I would test drive both.

ElectricPaul · January 16, 2017

8 minutes ago, Bodmeister said:

My findings were: Premier ( doesn't come with AVS anyway) was fidgety over uneven/potholed roads, buttery smooth on motorway and smooth roads.

F Sport with AVS( can tell by sport + mode) . Non fidgety over uneven/potholed roads but noisy on motorway, smooth roads. This is just MY opinion! Others may have different opinions. Hence, drive it for 24/48 hours over different surfaces and then decide. Ask them if you can have the two variants over a couple of days. They both handle VERY differently!

Bodmeister, could the difference be tyres? In my experience tyres vary enormously, especially when it comes to noise. I see from the brochure that the Luxury models run on 225/60 R18 tyres. There's no mention of F Sport tyre size. Are they the same size, and if so, are they the same make/type of tyre?

As I said earlier, my local dealer only has Sport and F Sport demonstrators, so I can't try the two back to back.

rayaans · January 16, 2017

9 minutes ago, ElectricPaul said:

Bodmeister, could the difference be tyres? In my experience tyres vary enormously, especially when it comes to noise. I see from the brochure that the Luxury models run on 225/60 R18 tyres. There's no mention of F Sport tyre size. Are they the same size, and if so, are they the same make/type of tyre?

As I said earlier, my local dealer only has Sport and F Sport demonstrators, so I can't try the two back to back.

The NX premier and F-Sport run on the same brand and type of tyres.

The difference in size is marginal, width is more of a problem in cars than length is. 1.5" is barely anything, remember that this is a total of whats been added on both sides, not just stuck onto one!

Bodmeister · January 16, 2017

I thought that too at first. But on inspection, both cars were on Yokohamas . The only difference I could see was the Premier was on 225/60 18 and the F sport was 235/60 18. Could be wrong though, was couple years ago!

GSLV6 · January 17, 2017

16 hours ago, ElectricPaul said:

Thanks everyone for helpful replies.

Regarding size rayaans, my reading of the dimensions gives the NX as nearly 6" shorter, 1.5" narrower and 3" lower than the 'old' RX. I consider that significant enough to be noticeable.

DJP, can you switch off the ASC. on my previous short ride in an F Sport I found it annoying. I'm used to a CVT gearbox with the Subaru and like it, so I have no problem with the way the hybrid system operates regarding apparent lack of gears.

GSLV6, being retired I fortunately no longer need to commute. Although I don"t off-road, I find increased ride height and AWD capability useful where I live in rural Dorset where we suffer flooded roads, potholes, general road damage and fords. My car usage is probably about 60% of round trips of up to 15 or 20 miles to my local town, 20% up to 100 or 150 miles and 20% longer trips of say 300 to 500 miles (the latter 2 or 3 times a year).

Bodmeister, you mention you prefer the ride of the F Sport and then say you find the ride fidgety on uneven/potholed roads. Do you mean the ride of your Premier is fidgety, or is it the F Sport that's guilty? I'm interested in your comments because, as I said in my earlier post, it's what i described as the jittery ride at slow speeds on poor surfaces that annoys me about my Forester! It sounds as though the NX may suffer similar traits.

Anyway, I've arranged for a 24 hour test in a NX300h F Sport. Unfortunately, my local dealer does not have a Premier or Luxury model as a demonstrator so I won't be able to test the two different suspension setups back to back.

I'll report back.

If this is a serious consideration, perhaps look at an RX as well? I don't find the ride fidgety or choppy at all in my F-sport 3RX. Oddly enough, I found it worse in the standard suspension RX Luxury model. Although the F-Sport has firmer tuned suspension, I think that it's the lateral dampers that make the ride more comfortable, with less roll and damping of vibrations into the cabin. It may be worthwhile seeing if you can get your dealer to provide an RX in the F-sport model for comparison with the NX as that'll be more definitive for you as they are really two quite different cars to drive.

January 17, 2017

We had a NX in 2014 when they first came out and it is a very comfortable car,but after a year we changed to a 18 month old RX450h Advance which we have had over a year now and love it,it just has that better power and space and the mpg is not much different either.Its very practical too with a good boot space.

Ours has beige carpet in the boot but a lexus rubber cargo mat fits perfectly and keeps it spotless.

ElectricPaul · January 18, 2017

Had my ride yesterday. For some unknown reason the dealer decided to put me in an NX Sport rather than an F Sport, despite the fact that it was the one model I wouldn't be buying. I was at least able to try the standard suspension setup. To be honest, I was very disappointed, particularly with the road/tyre noise - it was worse than my Forester on winter tyres. The ride and handling were pretty good, but it didn't like drain covers or potholes. I loved the quality of the interior, but found the non-touch screen infotainment fiddly, although I'm sure it is something I would get used to.

I was disappointed with the fairly limited adjustment on the driver's seat and steering wheel compared to the RX. I think I'm going to look for a suitable RX a little older than the NX and try to persuade the wife it's not really very big. Funnily enough, when I got back to the dealer a customer had parked an RX alongside an NX which was useful in making a direct comparison of size. I have to say that rayaans is right - seen together there really isn't a lot of difference in size. I took a photo with my phone to make the point to the wife!

We'll see where we go from here. I'll keep you posted. Thanks everyone for your input.

GSLV6 · January 19, 2017

Sounds like you've made a pretty firm conclusion there Paul. I must admit, from a ride quality, I preferred the RX, but if you go for one, don't be put off by the firmer suspension of the F Sport because the lateral dampers do help limit body roll plus they help with cabin comfort. If you can hunt down an F-Sport, you may prefer it to the standard one. VFM has to be any of the Advance models, but you wont get things like the HUD in those, which I find very useful as you don't have to take your eyes off the road.

In driving, you're right. There's not a huge difference. The RX is a little taller, wider and longer but not by a large margin, yet it offers considerably more cabin and load space, and seats, while lacking the 10-way adjustability of the Mk3 GS or the 3RX Premier are still 8-way adjustable so you'll find a comfortable setting. I also found the seating in the RX more comfortable than the NX, and you feel like you're sat in them (ie they're more cosseting). Colour choice is a little limited in the 3RX, and most I've seen at my local dealers tend to be white (Arctic or Polar) which looks good, but I prefer the silver. I think there's also two choices of black (Velvet and Metallic) and a Burgundy colour.

You soon get used to the infotainment system with its mouse pad and you can adjust the sensitivity of the mouse pad for feedback. It took me about a week to be able to navigate round everything without giving it a second thought, and now I prefer it to the more usual wheel controls.

Bear in mind that it's a 2.2t vehicle, it'll never glide over bumps and potholes because the suspension has to be firm enough to deal with a lot of weight, but saying that, I find ours no worse than many lighter cars. Road noise can be a lot to do with tyres. A change of tyres can drastically reduce noise and a little research will show which perform best. I have to say that the OEM Dunlops on the 19 inch rims aren't too bad but there's better.

Good luck and keep us posted....oh, we want pictures!