06 GS450h - won't drive - urgent help needed!

markirl · August 20, 2016

Hi Folks,

I bought a GS450h last week that has been lying up for a while. Have put about 500 miles on the car and really enjoying it. However, today when out in torrential rain the car popped up with the dreaded Check Hybrid System message, followed by check EBC & check VSC. It did the same thing when I bought it as the 12v Battery was dead but I have since installed a new one with no issues since. I managed to get the car home on hybrid only mode but have drained the Battery down to 1 bar. When the car tries to start now there is a horrible grinding noise from the transmission tunnel area. The car felt like it was misfiring shortly before this happened and wouldn't run smoothly - it now appears to start and run fine.

Car is basically completely immobilised, I'm trying to find my scanner but does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks in advance.

steve2006 · August 20, 2016

Hello and welcome to the LOC.

I seem to remember the Battery on the hybrids needs to be a special type and includes a temperature sensor, did you replace it with like for like?

Britprius · August 20, 2016

Your description of the fault is a little confusing saying (quote) "When the car tries to start now there is a horrible grinding noise from the transmission tunnel area." Then "it now appears to start and run fine."

The 12 volt Battery is nothing special. It does have a temperature sensor that can be removed, and fitted to the top of a replacement. This sensor helps control the charging voltage for the 12 volt Battery.

Can you get the car into ready mode? Put the car in drive with the parking brake off holding the foot brake firmly on with your left foot. Then apply some accelerator. The display should show the traction Battery charging. This is called force charging, and is safe to do as all the engine power goes to MG1 (motor generator one) to provide a charging voltage.

John

markirl · August 20, 2016

Apologies for being unclear, what I meant was the engine sounds fine until the horrible grinding noise came in from the transmission area. Regarding the 12v Battery issue, I'd read up on it and the thermistor was placed on the new Battery at the time. So to clarify the above, previously the car would go to "ready" mode, then engine would turn on and approx 2-3 seconds later, the check EBC and check VSC warnings would show up and the car would stop running accompanied by some grinding noise from the transmission tunnel area.

Since posting this thread, I have read this excellent thread: GS450h Loss of Power which describes a pump in the area of the noise I was hearing and a friend came over with a scan tool. The only code the car would produce in the generic sealey scan tool was P3191 which just means "engine did not start". We decided to try and start the car and low and behold it started perfectly, but not without a very short grindy noise from the transmission area, then just a consistent mechanical light clicking noise. Car is currently charging and running perfectly with no errors. I will go out and check it again once it has cooled down again.

So I believe my issue is the transmission motor pump unless anyone has any other suggestions?

markirl · August 20, 2016

Also, should my car have an undertray under the back of the engine & below the gearbox?

Britprius · August 20, 2016

26 minutes ago, markirl said:

Apologies for being unclear, what I meant was the engine sounds fine until the horrible grinding noise came in from the transmission area. Regarding the 12v battery issue, I'd read up on it and the thermistor was placed on the new battery at the time. So to clarify the above, previously the car would go to "ready" mode, then engine would turn on and approx 2-3 seconds later, the check EBC and check VSC warnings would show up and the car would stop running accompanied by some grinding noise from the transmission tunnel area.

Since posting this thread, I have read this excellent thread: GS450h Loss of Power which describes a pump in the area of the noise I was hearing and a friend came over with a scan tool. The only code the car would produce in the generic sealey scan tool was P3191 which just means "engine did not start". We decided to try and start the car and low and behold it started perfectly, but not without a very short grindy noise from the transmission area, then just a consistent mechanical light clicking noise. Car is currently charging and running perfectly with no errors. I will go out and check it again once it has cooled down again.

So I believe my issue is the transmission motor pump unless anyone has any other suggestions?

Your description of the fault is a little confusing saying (quote) "When the car tries to start now there is a horrible grinding noise from the transmission tunnel area." Then "it now appears to start and run fine."

The 12 volt Battery is nothing special. It does have a temperature sensor that can be removed, and fitted to the top of a replacement. This sensor helps control the charging voltage for the 12 volt Battery.

Can you get the car into ready mode? Put the car in drive with the parking brake off holding the foot brake firmly on with your left foot. Then apply some accelerator. The display should show the traction Battery charging. This is called force charging, and is safe to do as all the engine power goes to MG1 (motor generator one) to provide a charging voltage.

John

I agree with you on the transmission pump theory. That was going to be my next suggestion.

Generic scanners will not work on Toyota based vehicles. I suggest you buy a "Mini VCI" from eBay or amazon as with this you will be able to read all codes.

markirl · August 20, 2016

Ok, I will order a Mini VCI tonight, thanks.

I believe the pump is at fault, must have completely seized throwing an error and not allowing the car to be driven and I will hopefully rectify this with a bearing replacement.

My car appears to only have the radiator splash guard, and no other. This is frustrating as I'm nearly sure it had the main splash guard when I bought it as I remember looking around it for leaks. It went into Toyota for a service so I guess I could ask them if they still have it...

Britprius · August 20, 2016

I will check my car underside tomorrow and report back.

John

markirl · August 20, 2016

Thanks for all your help - this is a fantastic forum!

Britprius · August 21, 2016

17 hours ago, markirl said:

Thanks for all your help - this is a fantastic forum!

On my car it has plastic covers under the engine and gearbox. Also side panels covering the floor pans, and rear of the car.

John

markirl · August 21, 2016

Thanks, looks like I'm missing two covers - the one under the engine and the one under the gearbox. I wonder did this have an affect..

markirl · September 5, 2016

Hi folks,

I have replaced the bearings in the transmission pump as per the other threads. Car drove fine afterwards apart from a very noticeable clunk at times when the engine shut off.

So my Mini VCI cable arrived and a scan has shown up no real issues with the car. However, I am getting occasional random misfires according to the diagnostics (but isn't throwing any codes). I also don't appear to be able to read the hybrid system as I get an error each time.

When it's running now, it appears to have a loud hum or vibration when in the cabin that I don't remember from before.

I'm thinking that either the transmission is stuffed or the timing chain has jumped a tooth - any thoughts?

Britprius · September 5, 2016

Check the coils on top of the spark plugs are clean and dry. Add some injector cleaner to the fuel, and change the plugs this hopefully will stop the misfires. If the car has been standing for some time the fuel in the tank may not be that good. The timing chain theory is very doubtful.

With the VCI at the beginning of the process you have to choose a type number from memory 0707/0707-0708/0708. Try a different number as I had a similar problem and choosing a different number enabled access to all the ECUs.

I do not wish to jump the gun on the humming noise, but this can be a shorted winding on MG1 if it does it while standing still or a wheel bearing when on the move. Shorted winding's will be picked up by the VCI.

John

markirl · September 6, 2016

Thanks for the reply.

So the Techstream is displaying that it can connect to the Hybrid Control ECU but it gives back no codes, monitor is greyed out and if I try and get live data, it gives me the error - I don't think it's communicating properly. It's a v1.4.1 firmware cable which I think may be my issue.

Car isn't throwing up any codes of importance across any either the Engine or gearbox ECU which I find bizarre.

Mark

KentIS300 · September 11, 2016

On 06/09/2016 at 9:31 PM, markirl said:

Thanks for the reply.

So the Techstream is displaying that it can connect to the Hybrid Control ECU but it gives back no codes, monitor is greyed out and if I try and get live data, it gives me the error - I don't think it's communicating properly. It's a v1.4.1 firmware cable which I think may be my issue.

Car isn't throwing up any codes of importance across any either the Engine or gearbox ECU which I find bizarre.

Mark

My Techstream does exactly the same to me. I can read the error codes etc. And I can only see freeze frame date of when the error code appeared. But the monitor is greyed out and the live data is coming up with a communication error. :(