LS400 Failed MOT but looking good on the horizon

runsgrateasanut · January 29, 2016

Lets hope you can do something with your originals or amayana eventually restock. The US Seller "partscontainer" if you look at their negative feedbacks just for the last month I think you will come to the conclusion OES wont be OEM in some cases.

Spacewagon52 · February 2, 2016

Horray!

Just got through the MOT - no problems to remedy!

Some advisories:-

Did mention corrosion on suspension parts - one rear spring quite corroded.

Considering treating underboidy, particularly steering and suspension parts with a rust inhibitor (Kurust?) and the copious covering with waxoyl.

To try and slow down the inevitable!

Would appreciate any comments on the efficacy of the above.

Scribe · February 2, 2016

Congratulations David! Great result. My 2014 MOT advised generalised corrosion to a number of underbody parts but it seems to have been an over-zealous tester because last year it sailed through with no advisories even though no underbody wrk had been done. Which is not to say that rustproofing is a waste of time, though.

Jacques Wood · February 3, 2016

***Latest update,

A member has very kindly donated a rear UCA. I've placed it in the parts washer. And will get it out to companies this week,

My initial impression is that the bushes and ball joint are indeed press fit. So theoretically, the bushes and ball joint could be replaced. But I'll dig deeper and check the bores for suitability of reuse once they're removed.

Fingers crossed.

On the exhaust side, I will hopefully have a price for the Y-pipe tonight.

On a side note, Lexus UK and amayama are giving me the "lead time not known" answer on front wheel speed sensors (a continuing problem on my LS that causes the ABS to activate just before coming to a halt). So I'm going to do more research into finding an alternative on those as well.

runsgrateasanut · February 3, 2016

You can buy the Arm bushes on eBay £30 or £170 if you want the Poly things. Its the Ball joint that will be the difficult part to source, I imagine.

Looking forward to seeing what your S/S Exhgaust man may make up. Will this be with CAD so that it can be replicated exactly?

With regard to dispensing with the Cats it may not be a wise move as you have LPG. I may be wrong, but it may not give your ECU accurate enough info? Others will correct me on this. You may want to check out the LPGforum.co.uk where they are always extremely helpful.

Colin M · February 6, 2016

As regards treating the underbody, yes, David, it can be done but it is a time-consuming and messy job - I have done it on both my LS400s.

The hardest bit is the rear sub-frame due to limited access - there are lots of suspension links in the way, as well as limited access at the top due to the sub-frame being close to the body. I removed as much rust as I could, some of it loose and some of it not so loose, before treating. There is not really much access for power tools like angle grinders and I used a range of hand tools.

The not so loose rust was removed with a hammer and chisel and with the pointed end of a hammer (it was an old hammer for chipping slag off welds done with an arc welder and had a V shaped point at each end, a vertical point at one end and a horizontal one at the other end). Other tools used included coarse files, coarse sandpaper and wire brushes of various sizes.

Once I had removed as much rust as I could, I then gave everywhere a good rub over with prep-paint wipe to remove any grease. You can buy pre-paint wipe from paint factors. It is not particularly expensive (I bought 5 litres for about £10 a few years ago) and it is better than white spirit as it evaporates much quicker.

I painted some of the more accessible areas with a coat of black Rustbuster Epoxy Mastic (a two pack steel renovation paint) and later followed this with a coat of black Hammerite. I used Waxoyl on the less accessible areas.

I have posted up a couple of photos of one car which I took when it was on the ramp at its MOT. If you are wondering what the blue pipe is coming out of the spare wheel well, it is the pipe to the LPG tank.

Jacques Wood · February 9, 2016

Sorry for the slow update, I had a last minute international situation for work to handle (sounds much more exciting that it really was)

Update on the exhaust, making the S/S version before my MOT didn't happen, my exhaust chap couldn't make it in time as he's had to take on a Motorsport contract.

Instead he removed the old cats and Y pipe, removed and replaced the flanges on both (seems mine had failed both sides) and re fitted the OEM parts, below is a picture of the work. I'm very impressed with it. He's welded on different style flanges, that negate the expensive crush gasket found on the OEM exhaust.

I'll admit, it's arguably an inferior design, but this cost me next to nothing (I won't quote on it unless it was a "mates rates" deal). and the car is now silent (I've had the exhaust blow since I bought it, so this lack of sound is very strange to me, though I can now hear a knock from the offside front damper (typical).

I'll try to keep the momentum up and get pictures of the new S/S exhaust ASAP.

Titch LS · February 9, 2016

David, The best rustproofer I have ever used is Bilt Hamber's DYNAX S50. It doesn't require re coating like Waxoyl does. It is a much more effective and longer-lasting rust treatment for around the same cost. It also sprays into crevises easier than Waxoyl. It's great stuff.

Spacewagon52 · February 9, 2016

Thanks Brian! I will look into that!

runsgrateasanut · February 9, 2016

The flanges look good. When you say different style, what do you mean? Do they not require any form of compound between them? Are they stock flanges? If so I'd be interested to know what the dimensions are and where purchased.

Jacques Wood · February 9, 2016

45 minutes ago, runsgrateasanut said:

The flanges look good. When you say different style, what do you mean? Do they not require any form of compound between them? Are they stock flanges? If so I'd be interested to know what the dimensions are and where purchased.

From factory there is a ring gasket. There are pictures below, but the best way to describe it is like a tightly wound watch spring, it sits in a recess in the flange between the two pipes (in my case the cats and the Y pipe). it's installed with some sort of sealing compound (had turned to a brittle ceramic when removed). I believe the principle of it is that can expand easily to breach any gaps when heat is first applied and stay in shape for the life of the exhaust. We use them at work in motorsport applications, but I've never looked into them in detail, it's just considered a standard for high quality applications.

Anyway, I cut some flange shapes on a water cutter to the same size and shape as a metal crush gasket I could readily get my hands on, which is what you see in the finished pictures above. It's cheap and cheerful and works perfectly, but it was just to get it though the MOT (yes putty may have worked, but I like doing jobs properly).

runsgrateasanut · February 10, 2016

Why haven't I got a water cutter in my tool box! Stamps feet!!

Did you use the gasket even though there was no trough for it to sit in, as a means of sealing the two flanges?

I reckon there could be a good market for those flanges. I know someone on eBay produces the triangular (almost) flanges for the top end of the Cats, which frankly never deteriorates, but finding someone who will produce the bottom flange I've had no joy.

I have a pair of spare Cats for a later model which I'd like to experiment with attaching new flanges before disposing of them. Bolt hole Alignment is the tricky bit if the Y pipe is not available.

plastic orange · February 10, 2016

Standard practise for plain flanged joints is just to smear silicon sealer between them and tighten up. Works just great on the stainless system on my V8 Morris Minor. In fact a lot of V8's don't even have exhaust manifold gaskets, just rely on sealer.

Pete

Jacques Wood · February 10, 2016

Pete at PTR who did my flanges says that worst case the total job is £250 inc VAT fitted cost. This includes removing the exhaust, fitting new flanges on Y pipe and cats with gaskets, also includes new studs on exhaust manifold (mine were rusted and sheared) and replacing the slip joint exhaust clamp on the other end of the Y pipe (mine was seized). However it could all be cheaper if yours isn't as far gone as mine!

So it is a drive in/drive out service, but you need to work around him and his schedule, which I understand isn't ideal.

if anyone does want to enquire further, talk to Pete: pete@ptrexhausts.co.uk

He can also specify full systems, including mufflers, cats/decats/sports cats, or full upgrades including manifolds for anything you own (My Ducati is next :-D)

runsgrateasanut · February 11, 2016

On 03/02/2016 at 11:37 AM, Jacques Wood said:

On a side note, Lexus UK and amayama are giving me the "lead time not known" answer on front wheel speed sensors (a continuing problem on my LS that causes the ABS to activate just before coming to a halt). So I'm going to do more research into finding an alternative on those as well.

There are plenty available on Rock Auto Parts in the states. Cheapest is £74.18 shipped £79.87 check out their site.

They are a pretty good source of parts. Lots for my Car now at reduced prices. Clearout stock.