Ls400 £12999

[Spacewagon52]

The debate continues - here Jason owned a LS 460 and he has bought a LS 400!

The mind boggles! Are the Ls 460's really not as good? Or are we just searching for nostalgia?

Owning a LS 400, the hairs on the back of my neck tingled when I read Jason's comments!

Took the LS 400 out for a spin last night .......... yes.... they are something special. I came out of McDonald's (can't afford a decent restaurant!) and the lights were shining on the alloys (though they are a bit corroded) - I thought it was a flashy Mercedes, then I realised it was mine! (Smug look - aka Jeremy Clarkson).

Enjoy Jason .... compared to other cars costing that much, you have got a bargain!

[JasonLS400]

Thanks spacewagon, there's just something about the 400 which was lost on the 430 and 460....I was so disappointed with the 460, the drive and feel was not what I'd hoped for. I knew when I first drove one but still bought it anyway, I thought it was "me" but after driving it for about 6 months I moved it on. I think the feel of the 460 leant more towards the euroboxes and lost the wow of the 400 which first got me in to the Lexus brand.

The mk4 with DHP for me is the ultimate, I've had many cars over the years, some really expensive ones, yet nothing comes close to a 400.

[Spacewagon52]

That is so interesting. There IS something quite special about a LS 400 (especially considering its age) which is very different from anything I have driven (experience limited) before. It is comforting that I am not the only person who thinks this way about the 400. Will try to keep mine going as long as I can afford it. When I can't, hopefully someone else will come along and keep her running.

I have a friend who was a big Landrover fan ......... eventually he got fed-up with breakdowns and repairs. His argument for keeping the 90 was that it had soul. The LS 400 certainly has SOUL, in bucketfuls!

[Malc]

..... I've never driven a car with so much, well so much of everything that's the very very best and with which I have EMPATHY too ...... 15 years now with Ls400s and having been driving since I was 17 ? ( I think in those days , 1967 ) and having driven all sorts of marques from RR and Bentleys, huge Mercedes, Aston Martin, big old Rovers, several classic cars ( classic then, let alone they would be now ) and everything down to old fashioned minis, tiny Fiats and everything in between ......... there really is nothing like my Ls400

......... and even with the money available to " upgrade " to anything else I wanted ......... I just know I would be disappointed in any replacement.

Malc

[Spacewagon52]

Malcolm, you are now making me nervous about taking her out of the garage!

[Malc]

... hahahahaha ... these dear old ladies just have to be used every single day ........... . they are such a joy to drive, and thrive upon it

Malc

[Scribe]

I hardly ever drive modern cars, which bewilder me because I'm used to 1990s technology. Even so, I find it hard to imagine a more pleasant and relaxing drive than the LS400 - except perhaps a 430, which looks roomier. And it's the only car I've owned that seems not to age. When I bought it five years ago my mechanic said, 'You can run it for ten years', and he was right - it's running as well as it did then. The cambelt's being replaced next week, and apart from the dreaded starter motor problem this will be the only big expense so far. It's probably still worth what I paid for it, but that isn't much - and what else would you get for the money?

[Tulpen]

Jason,

Just as a matter of interest what, exactly, didn't you like about the 460?

I drove a 400 for 15 years then changed to a 460. I find the 460 superior to the 400 in almost every way and I'm baffled by your comments.

Or is it just 'horses for courses'?

[JasonLS400]

Hi Tulpen,

The LS400 drive I feel is far more relaxed, smooth power delivery, gentle brakes....glides along on the magic carpet soaking up lumps and bumps. The LS460 didnt have this, the brakes were far to keen for me, even when trying to come to a gentle stop at slow speed, I felt like a nodding duck sat in the car, they'd bite slowly then suddenly grab. Also the magic carpet had gone in LS460, probably down to the larger wheels and low profile tyres but it felt no different than a BMW or Audi - Granted the LS460 is a far more modern car, inside the LS400 does feel dated by todays standard and the sat nav like an old Atari - but the ride and drive quality is by far the best I've ever driven. Even the LS430 to me which I had about 12 months (30,000 miles) had lost the LS400 "feel", hence I'd hoped to get this back in the 460 but I was so dissapointed.....so moved to Land Rovers !!! - I'd always been on the lookout for another 400, but wanted low miles / mint which are getting very rare now to find.....when this one came along I knew I must have it despite the price, I'm so glad I did, its exactly how I remember the 400 to be.

Probably though......'horses for courses'?

:-)

[Spacewagon52]

Quote: ."........but the ride and drive quality is by far the best I've ever driven. "

This is what really grabs me about the 400. Toys are fun to play with, but just to cruise along, even a 30 mph, and enjoy the smoothness of the ride, engine and gearbox is enough for me. The sound system is superb to my old ears but I often have it off just to enjoy the peace and quiet.

Are we going a bit OTT? I hope not, as I do not wish to be disappointed.

[Tulpen]

'Are we going a bit OTT?'

Possibly.......but this is the LS Forum - so why not? :)

[Scribe]

Jason, I haven't even sat in a 460, let alone driven one. But my mechanic has, and he says that although they're fantastic machines they have a very different feel to a 400. Much more modern and high-tech, obviously, but like other modern, high-tech cars and less individual than old Lexuses. I seem to remember he also found the ride harsher and noisier. I guess it's what you're used to - if you've had a 400, you compare everything else to it. In the same way I still miss the ride of my Xantia (though not the rest of the car).

[JasonLS400]

Hi scribe, the 400 was designed totally for comfort, over engineered for its time but in the right way giving It the X factor, I think later models became to OTT trying to keep ahead of the Germans with gizmos, and styling and lost focus on what drew people like me to Lexus in the first place, it's all about comfort for me, with whisper quiet engine (and a good stereo ).

I remember the first time I drove a Peugeot 405, I thought it was wonderful, the best car I'd ever driven.......(I know, but I'd just come from an Austin allegro ).....as I progressed through a few cars that feeling went as soon when I bought my first mk1 400....150k on the clock and ran like new, since I've never driven another car that had that "feel"........until 2 weeks ago when I bought the mk4 and it being exactly what I remember......I'm just so glad I did it

[cruisermark]

jason do you yours as an everyday car or occasional car?

[cruisermark]

post moved

[mikeyv]

yes the gold 56k one is originally member "willydoits" car which was bought by a private trader (same trader that bought the 29k silver LS which was sold to TH bohler which is now jasons car)

looks like the car has had a professional valet and professionally photographed - cant fault it really and no doubt it will sell

Wrong thread?

[cruisermark]

yes sorry didnt realise

[moriwaki]

Thank to Jason....I was starting to think it was just me....and that I had somehow bought a rogue 460 ...

I had my 400 MK3 for 6 years and it had 120,000 on when I bought it....I did another 90,000 of the happiest motoring I had ever experienced in 30 odd years of driving...

The main reason I ended up going for a 460 was a bit of rust on the 400....around the arches and the windscreen....I paniced a bit over nothing....if I had the chance again....and know what I know now...I would have spent as much as it cost treat the 400 to a full Top Notch respray....and still own the best car I have ever owned.

Fact is a friend of mine has always admired the car....and when I was set on a 460 I gave it to him as a gift....

the 460...was a one owner car with 9,000 miles on....I did not even test drive it....went on the train from Cumberland to Turriff....near Aberdeen....and drove it back through the night...

I knew in the first mile I had made a mistake....but I thought wait a minute....this is a 460...ten years younger than my old 400....with only 9000 miles on....it MUST be Me.

We set off for Venice a few days later....drove there non stop...took 26 hours from Cumberland....and every mile was full of thoughts of what a pleasure this would be in the old 400....and what a poor experience it was in this 460....BUT I still ...over the next year or so....tried to convince myself I was mistaken.

What I didnt like about the 460 : Brakes are almost impossible to judge....like you have no real connection to them....terrible.

Steering was a mystery....some days it was OK ish...other days it had a a mind of its own....over one bridge I regularly crossed ...it would dart around as if the Mysterons were driving it !

The steering also felt like an old car with worn out Track Control arms ....worn ball joints etc....wandered around over road irregularities....awful sensation through the steering wheel.

Cruise control was so bad I gave up using it...and oh boy did I try to master it....but it mastered ME in the end....far too complicated for its own good.

Wind noise around mirrors...tried the well known Internet fix by using a caulking gun on the trim etc....a little better....but still there....better if you put the windown DOWN a few mm ?

Tyre noise is a given....and was expected with the quite frankly "Stupid" on a car like this ....low profiles rubber....

Engine lacked low down torque....needed to get it revving to make progress...again....in a car like this...Stupid IMO.

Far too many gears....always hunting around...

And Mark Levinson my arse....the 400 Stereo was better too.

At this point I must again apologise to anyone who is enjoying their 460....I am not here to upset anyone....but to find someone who was a dissapointed as me....

in thinking he was trading UP to a 460....is a relief....I thought I had imagined the whole thing.

Things I didnt like about the 400 MK3.....cant open the boot with the engine running.....that was annoying....but thats IT.

Again..... just my opinion.....but that 400... is one of.....if not The Best Car ever made.....and to think you can waft around in one... for less than the price of one years depreciation on any new car on the market....well....quite frankly.....if you dont have one....your Crackers.....err...hang on....I havent got one right now.....excuse ?...need a Jeep for the muddy Hounds to jump in the back of.

Things I liked on the 460....the looks....it is a Great looking car....with a great interior.....and the rear view camera was a Godsend.

Sorry for long post lads....but hey lads......who else would listen ? ?

[Malc]

..... I have adjusted to the boot not being able to be opened with the engine running .................... and with ordinary tyres ( which I have ) just not using it in snow and ice ( coz it does it's own thing ) ...... but as a Grand Tourer and cruising car whatever, whenever and wherever, well, I guess it's just about unsurpassable .......... especially with boy racers next to me at the traffic lights that never manage to outpace me ever ( if I'm in the mood )

Malc

[ambermarine]

Three years ago when I realized the 22 year old Mark 1 I had owned for 16 years was passed its sell by date I had some serious thinking about the replacement ,the only thing I was sure of it was going to be a Lexus.

I studied the members posts on all of the LS range and money being no object I was not limited in price.

I did not take on board any of the professional pundits views dealership blurb or Jeremy the thug,I simply looked at my past experience with all my cars and the Mark1 and realized that after seven years of initial development and a further ten years of refinement there could only be one car the "Lexus LS400 Mark IV" There as never been another car ever made that as seventeen years of development in one guise so it as to be as near perfect as it can be.As someone as already said it is probably the best car ever built and ever likely to be.