Will Vag Car Owners Pay Higher Taxes?

[noby76]

so I am sure all have heard about the Volkswagen/Audi cars emitting higher pollutants than the manufactures stated in their newer cars which results in them charging a premium and I guess the consumer paying less in taxes with some models emitting up to 4 times more or 50% more than stated by VAG.

if test results were found to be true for UK models cars does this mean the government would need to re asses the rates they are currently charging road tax for mainly newer diesel car drivers? as I believe it wont be fair on drivers of cars who are having to pay more on road tax if their cars were emitting similar as the VAG models but the VAG driver pays less in road taxes. will mainly petrol drivers have a case here if results prove UK VAG models had the manipulating software.. ??

[dave1]

Apparently the EU/UK test is different to the US which has far more stringent regulations on emissions. There should be no change to taxation class/rates in UK according to a report on BBC TV News this morning.

[Deadloak]

I doubt they would, as probably dup'd as much as the US goverment testers. But would you honestly believe what the UK is saying about the VW's testing in the UK, I wouldn't.

David.

[noby76]

your guess was a s good as mine DeadLoak..when the story surfaced, most testers actually confirmed the accurate method of testing a cars true emission is to actually have it on the road running with the testing device strapped on it.. most of the testing carried in UK is done in a lab so then again might not be that accurate who knows..

[Ace8800]

I think they wont change the tax band on sold cars, but they will change it on those in production.

what I want to know is, who else is in on it..lol

the reports in the morning said they could be other car manufactures involved..

I think all the Germans will be investigated 1st on the list will be the VAG group (Audi, Seat)

[noby76]

cough BMW cough.. Merc cough lol

[dave1]

The tests are carried out differently in UK. It was "What Car" on BBC this morning who explained it all.

Sorry David but could not make sense of your post!

"What UK is say about the VWs in the UK"??????

[dave1]

I think they wont change the tax band on sold cars, but they will change it on those in production.

what I want to know is, who else is in on it..lol

the reports in the morning said they could be other car manufactures involved..

I think all the Germans will be investigated 1st on the list will be the VAG group (Audi, Seat)

VW are part of VAG.

[Ace8800]

yeah I know, that's why i said audi and seat next.. and yes cough cough defo BMW/MERC lol

[Bluesman]

I would think the small amount of increase in Road Tax will pale into insignificance against how much the cars will devalue now. Mike.

[dave1]

To be fair, it is so far only in the US who have stricter regs. Probably don't need "fiddle anything" to meet EU/UK regs.

The harm to the brand will be huge. If other manufacturers are involved then don't just look at so called German marques, any manufacturer could be at it.

[rayaans]

Diesel's going to take a huge knock - id be surprised if people still buy them now!

Id imagine some "Green" folk will be protesting about it outside Downing Street. Would be great to see VW done over tbh, its just outright deceit.

[dave1]

Diesel powered cars will still sell unfortunately. Emission tests should take account of the fact that diesel fumes are known to contain carcinogens.

[Deadloak]

The tests are carried out differently in UK. It was "What Car" on BBC this morning who explained it all.

Sorry David but could not make sense of your post!

"What UK is say about the VWs in the UK"??????

Ha ha, edited. I'm sorry but this site doesn't work very well on my browser. Sometimes can't back-space, and skips words and characters.

David (bad Tripe-ist)

[michaelH]

from the New York Times:

Volkswagen have now admitted that up to 11 million cars were affected, but have declined to say where the 11 million affected vehicles — more cars than Volkswagen produces in a year — were. But analysts said that as many as 10 million were probably in Europe, where Volkswagen is the dominant manufacturer, with more than double the market share of any competitor, and where diesels account for more than half of all vehicles sold. “There really aren’t many diesel cars outside of Europe and North America,” said Philippe Houchois, head of European auto industry research at UBS in London.

[noby76]

confirmation on bbc

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34345210

[dave1]

Confirmation of what John? It doesn't really clarify anything with regards to UK since all that is being said by EU is that the results and methods etc will be looked at and random checks carried out.

[noby76]

i was under the impression UK was part of the EU and if VW has confirmed EU cars are affected then sure UK models will be too? the below article proves emissions testing is flawed anyway with EU countries involved in lobbying acts

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/sep/24/uk-france-and-germany-lobbied-for-flawed-car-emissions-tests-documents-reveal

[dave1]

That article indicates that various countries governing bodies allowed a loophole to be used with their full agreement by allowing things such as fully charged batteries to be used to eliminate emissions caused by the alternator making the engine emit more carbon. If you fully read and digest the article it appears that whilst the tests may have shown lower readings it would appear that it was within the EU rules.

I am not arguing that the tests were possibly flawed but that doesn't mean to say that owners will have tax bands changed upwards. The new revised EU test is coming, according to your linked article, in 2017 so that would be the time when cars produced from that time might be re-banded.

[noby76]

i did read and completely understood the article and not just the title...

regardless of how you look at it, I think everyone can agree there has been some dishonesty and manipulation going on for who knows how long from both VAG and EU governments all selling us the notion and idea diesel cars are better in terms of environmental pollution when clearly they not.. obviously this was clearly a way for VAG to shift more diesel cars as they more or less perfected that technology compared to say the Japanese car manufactures and governments to charge more at the pumps for diesel drivers. lets see what happens in 2017

[philthy]

If there is any change in the VED rate for diesels including the Touareg (there is nothing that suggests the 3.0 V6 TDi utilises any software), it is likely to apply to vehicles not yet registered. To impose a higher rate on already registered vehicles would be a certain vote loser for any government meaning only the Greens or the nut job Corbyn would be likely to be so stupid. It would more likely be like the changes introduced for vehicles registered before 2006 and be an amendment to the changes coming in in 2017 for all new vehicles. It could see existing vehicles become sought after much like pre 2006 vehicles.

On the testing though, what have VW or anyone else done. The testing authorities present the method of the test and the target to hit. VW have complied with that test. What the US now object to is the results are different for real world driving conditions. Well maybe if they had a test replicating real world driving conditions VW and anyone else who used the software may have designed their engines differently. A good barrister might be able to make a claim against the US for damages despite the fact that the properties in diesels are more harmful than thought.

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[philthy]

This is the key to it being more than likely that no retrospective hike in VED will be applied. See note 3 at the bottom of the table which shows that the last change in VED was not retrospectively applied to vehicles registered before March 2006 despite high emissions and poor fuel economy.

[PaulWhitt20]

From today's Telegraph.

[philthy]

Don't see how, nothing has or is likely to change, that has any effect on already registered vehicles. Plus I can still leave my diesel for weeks without incurring a flat Battery [emoji6]

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[lee789]

I think if VW (or the cars of any other manufacturer who have used similar tactics) are found to have inaccurate emissions, the Government will most definitely increase the Excise Duty to the correct level. It will then be down to owners to sue the manufacturer(s) for the additional cost, and the depreciation of their vehicles caused by their dishonesty.It would be an unpopular move to do this, but it is hardly fair for somebody to be able to drive one of the affected cars at a lower VED rate than it actually is, when other owners driving cars that flt into the same VED group have to pay the full rate. It will be a nice unexpected earner for the Government, and we all know they can't resist it when a windfall comes their way.