Car Price Inflation

[Spacewagon52]

An interesting comparison of prices from 1990 to now taking account of inflation.

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/cars/enthusiasts/are-new-cars-getting-more-expensive/ss-BBmbXiT?ocid=mailsignoutmd#image=22

The LS is less expensive now than in 1990!

[Titch LS]

Ah, but in 15 years or so, will the present LS460 be as reliable as my mk4 LS400 is now? I'm pretty sure that I will have had to spend more money on it in that time than has been spent on my 'pull out all the stops' LS400 . I hope, for future owners, that I'm wrong but I wouldn't bet on it. Have you noticed for example that the Lexus motto is no longer 'The Pursuit of Perfection' but has been changed to 'Amazing in Motion'. Significant?

[Cotswold Pete]

I think it comes down to the fact that when a new product comes to market there is a period of trial & error and corrective actions, which no doubt contributed to the very high price of a LS400 (and it did not make a profit - according to various sources).

Any company that thinks it has ironed out the problems then just keeps the machine producing the same thing. However the market demands change and the manufacturer needs to look at ways to stand out from the crowd, and if the new technology is not so tried and tested then you find out problems that never would have existed in your Mk1, Mk2 version (etc.)

So in theory your Mk5 Mk6 version will not have the same up front development costs, and the manufacturing process will have been fine tuned to save costs and time.

It does not make a 430 or a 460 worse, just tends to make them more complex which means more things to take more than a few years to come out in the wash.

The other thing is the economy of scale that China brought to the market through from early 2000 onwards (which meant even Lexus would find the supply chain being cheaper than the decade before).

The same thing has happened with TV's, Washing Machines etc, all cheaper than 20 years ago, all more features, and as a general rule about the same level of reliability (from my experience)

Overall I would rather buy a Lexus (or Toyota) over just about anything else, because I always consider the ongoing costs or ownership (not just of fuel), I apply the same rules to my HiFi, I have a 40 year old Thorens record deck (gets used most weeks), and it was not cheap at the time, but it sure as heck gives good value. I can buy it's equivalent today for about three times the price (but with inflation cheaper). Would I buy a new one? Only if the one I have blows up and I cannot find a good original TD160 to replace it. Same with the LS, I would only go for a 430, 460 if I could not find a good Mk4 to replace mine (should anything happen).

[Ruud]

From what I have read, the ls400, when first introduced to the US market, was very cheap.

So cheap that BMW accused Lexus of selling the LS below cost.

[mikeyv]

The problem with a 460 or 600 as an old car, will be the complexity and cost of any faults.

I seem to recall a post on here relating to the 600, where the repair cost was several thousand, which I'm afraid equates to a write off in the bangernomics community.

Compared to the 400 and 430, the 460 and 600 are pretty rare, so finding s/h spares will be difficult at best, and unlike a 400/430, you won't be able to buy another so easily if you scrap yours.

There's a 460 on eBay that I have on watch, it has a problem or two(cat C for starters!), but what a gorgeous interior.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361384872827?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

[Chris Skelton]

Not sure about 'the market' demanding change. Perhaps you're right.

When I think back to 70s/80s, etc, for example, Citroen DS; 1955 -75 with one update mid-stream. CX? 75 - 90, same thing. XM? 89 -2000.

But Lex changed LS every.....3?

Can't be cheap!

Cars seem to be more 'throwaway' these days -well small ones, which are sold as designer wants.

...and Pete. I have a pristine Townshend Rock/Origin Live RB300/Denon 304 now unused (LPs sold) you can have....£850!

[cleverdick]

Well, to continue with the 'turntable' theme, I would suggest that the SP-10MkII is the audio equivalent of the Gen1 LS400: Incredibly complex, yet with unmatched precision, extraordinary performance and ultimate reliability.

Prices have now gone through the roof - which is what we can expect to see with good examples of the original LS.

Early incarnations of anything revolutionary are often the best; manufacturers tend to 'over-engineer' simply because they haven't yet learned what they can get away with. Some of the first DAT machines (such as the DTC-1000) were heavily overbuilt, and as such (with certain mods) found a niche in the broadcast market.

I'm surprised, actually, that the LS400 platform was not used in professional/special vehicle aplications (police, ambulance etc.). Would also have made a great London taxi - that's for sure!

But I digress...

[Cotswold Pete]

Not sure about 'the market' demanding change. Perhaps you're right.

When I think back to 70s/80s, etc, for example, Citroen DS; 1955 -75 with one update mid-stream. CX? 75 - 90, same thing. XM? 89 -2000.

But Lex changed LS every.....3?

Can't be cheap!

Cars seem to be more 'throwaway' these days -well small ones, which are sold as designer wants.

...and Pete. I have a pristine Townshend Rock/Origin Live RB300/Denon 304 now unused (LPs sold) you can have....£850!

Chris,

If I was not about to spend £4K completely rebuilding my lounge, that would be tempting to get the Townshend, but more than likely going to tinker with the Thorens (ie: treat it like one would a classic car, and make a few improvements after running in it's original form).

As to selling your vinyl. Why? I still have all 600 LP's, 400 singles, but all cleaned so that they sound pretty good.

Also agree with Cleverdick about over-engineering, which does apply to the LS, the SP-10 etc etc, but I have a Pioneer D-07 DAT (very over-engineered), but it suffers a bit as I do not use it everyday, so it gets a bit stiff here and there.

I drive my LS400 every day, as I think it is designed to do that and do it for more than a couple of decades.

[dave1]

When the LS400 was introduced to the UK market, Jaguar got hold of at least 1 to strip completely. Every nut, washer etc was costed and they decided that it would be impossible to build it for what the retail price was. I suppose it might be different since it was "taken over" by TATA owners who have totally turned JLR around in terms of quality and profit.